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  • #46
    Originally posted by 754 View Post

    Apparently you have not heard of a wiper insert on a face mill ?
    the fact that 2 cutters are hitting the work , should be lower impact on the spindle... if unable to set it up, use a single tool.
    Were talking about brazed on fly cutters, wipers inserts are mostly for finish purposes.
    Beaver County Alberta Canada

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    • #47
      Originally posted by challenger View Post
      .............I'm feeding so it cuts below the rust as I've read about. Are there any obvious setup issues I'm in error doing? The chips are a huge issue as well and I'm going to make some sort of cardboard containment as they are getting thrown all over.
      Thanks for any input. ..........
      Looking at this again, I do not know that you needed to fly cut it, and probably did not really need to "get below the rust".

      My choice in this would probably have ended up with "use a flap wheel on the rust, grind down the weld, and see how flat it is.... (the dang thing is a griddle!". I do not recall being upset about how flat my hotcakes are.........)

      After the weld is ground down, and the rust removed, the edges probably do need to be flat enough to sit on the supports, but that is not hard to deal with.
      3751 6193 2700 3517

      Keep eye on ball.
      Hashim Khan

      If you look closely at a digital signal, you find out it is really analog......

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      • #48
        Redlee , I am talking a out brazed carbide ir highspeed steel. Different hights and diameter. The smaller dia should stick out a few thousand more.
        John b. SW Chicago burbs.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by john b View Post
          Redlee , I am talking a out brazed carbide ir highspeed steel. Different hights and diameter. The smaller dia should stick out a few thousand more.
          I understand what your saying, I guess I look at it this way.
          I can rough it with a single cutter fly, then put a finisher in and take a finishing cut faster than it takes to set a 2 cutter fly up.
          Each to his own.
          Beaver County Alberta Canada

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          • #50
            What ? Seriously? You cant touch cutter to work, lock spindle, slide second cutter to touch work, and lock in place , in like 3 or 4 minutes..or less.
            well then , maybe we really cannot help..

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            • #51
              Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

              Looking at this again, I do not know that you needed to fly cut it, and probably did not really need to "get below the rust".

              My choice in this would probably have ended up with "use a flap wheel on the rust, grind down the weld, and see how flat it is.... (the dang thing is a griddle!". I do not recall being upset about how flat my hotcakes are.........)

              After the weld is ground down, and the rust removed, the edges probably do need to be flat enough to sit on the supports, but that is not hard to deal with.
              I ended putting the plate in my spooge tank. It took all the rust off perfectly.
              I reground a tool bit and I'm making good progress fly cutting. I'm only taking about 20 thou per pass. This is time consuming but at least I'm learning something. Like fly cutting 15" square plate sucks.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by challenger View Post
                I will check the tram on the head ...
                Actually, you already have checked the tram. There are few better tests than flycutting.

                metalmagpie

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by 754 View Post
                  What ? Seriously? You cant touch cutter to work, lock spindle, slide second cutter to touch work, and lock in place , in like 3 or 4 minutes..or less.
                  well then , maybe we really cannot help..
                  Setscrews are notorious for dimpling and I bet if you get your dial on the tool then tighten it will move.
                  When we did line boring with shop made bars it was a pain to move the tool a few thou.
                  Thats why insert cutter heads have been around forever and are repeatably accurate.
                  As stated before each to his own and what works for you is what you do. I dont see the sense in continuing this debate, I do it my way and it works ,you do it your way and it works.
                  So on with our days and have a good one.
                  Beaver County Alberta Canada

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by challenger View Post

                    I ended putting the plate in my spooge tank. It took all the rust off perfectly.
                    I reground a tool bit and I'm making good progress fly cutting. I'm only taking about 20 thou per pass. This is time consuming but at least I'm learning something. Like fly cutting 15" square plate sucks.
                    The few times I've fly cut a surface I got the impression from how the machine handled it that .02 would be somewhat on the heavy side. I did the DOC by feel so I've got no numbers for you but the step in the surface to get the best final pass was really thin. I'd say .005'ish?

                    The cutting tool geometry might not be doing you any favors either. I know from my shaper work that the finish was horrid until I stopped using my "that looks about right" lathe tools and ground up some new tool bits with shapes and angles found in the shaper books I've got. Perhaps play with the tool bit geometries with your new flycutters.

                    I was looking at videos on shaper cutters and one in particular took a minute to explain that the top and back rake on the cutter was needed to ensure that the chip was not pushed back down and into the cut. The shape on a typical brazed carbide lathe tool usually has a little back rake but no end rake. Plus the impact against the harder weld beads might be micro chipping your carbide which leads to a nasty finish. You might be better off with HSS that is ground with a bit of both side and back rake.

                    And yes. due to the need to feed very slowly by virtue of the low RPM and the need to extend fully off the end of each pass by the full diameter of the sweep flycutting is notoriously and frustratingly slow. One reason why my shaper is becoming my go to machine for turning hot rolled surfaces into nice clean surfaces before progressing onto the rest of the projects. Especially now that I've smartened up and started proper shaper tool geometry.



                    Chilliwack BC, Canada

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Paul Alciatore View Post

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                      It is very well balanced so it can run at higher speeds.
                      A very nice cutter indeed.
                      One thing that makes a good flycutter is flywheel (mass).
                      You have no doubt heard spline chatter in the mill when flycutting.
                      Adding some friction to the spindle while wearing a leather glove helps some.
                      But having a very heavy flycutter (mass) helps carry the cutting bits through the cut.
                      Some larger mills, like Kearney and Trecker have flywheels inside their body, on the spindle shaft.
                      My Groton mill has a spindle spline lash eliminator adjustment also.
                      Again, nice fly cutter, might have even been smoother performing if the sides were not trimmed off
                      and the full round was left to add mass. But it is nice and beefy just as is.

                      --Doozer
                      DZER

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Doozer View Post

                        A very nice cutter indeed.
                        One thing that makes a good flycutter is flywheel (mass).
                        You have no doubt heard spline chatter in the mill when flycutting.
                        Adding some friction to the spindle while wearing a leather glove helps some.
                        But having a very heavy flycutter (mass) helps carry the cutting bits through the cut.
                        Some larger mills, like Kearney and Trecker have flywheels inside their body, on the spindle shaft.
                        My Groton mill has a spindle spline lash eliminator adjustment also.
                        Again, nice fly cutter, might have even been smoother performing if the sides were not trimmed off
                        and the full round was left to add mass.
                        But it is nice and beefy just as is.

                        --Doozer
                        And here I thought it was made from bar stock.
                        Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Arcane View Post

                          And here I thought it was made from bar stock.
                          I rather assumed the same. Otherwise why cut away the sides?

                          Paul?
                          Chilliwack BC, Canada

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                          • #58
                            3/4" straight shank, 2" 3 insert face mill $46 http://www.cdcotools.com/

                            I parked the fly cutters a few years ago as I got a 2 1/2" 4 positive rake insert wuhanium face mill on an R8 shank for like 35 bucks on ebay from a usa vendor. I bought a couple boxes of spare inserts and after using the thing perhaps 50 times it's still on the original inserts edge that can be flipped around. I can't even think how many times I had to regrind tools for the fly cutter as I got a bit aggressive on the rpm or feed rates and burned the edge off. Or the tool slipped a bit and suddenly is taking less of a cut.

                            Having used this modern contrivance, I maintain why bother with the chatter and the possibility that a fly cutter will 'fly' out of the holder. These shell jobbies are robust and you can spin the hell out of them as opposed to low rpm and a few thou per revolution creep along feed rates of a fly cutter. I say pony up the $50-70 bucks and you'll have something that works well for life.

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                            • #59
                              I make chips... just how does that work out for you when you try to resurface a cylinder head 6 inches wide.. ?

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                              • #60
                                work it on the granite plate for a few minutes.

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