Repairing sanding belts?

[challenger]

I mentioned this in the sidetracked thread. It seems that contact cement and tyvek are the most popular ways to repair belts that had seems separate via magic. I've been doing more reading and it seems like the glue that's used is a thermal activated glue. Anyone know of one that is commonly available?
FWIW, I spoke with a guitar builder I ran into today and he mentioned a synthetic Hyde glue?

[BCRider]

Hide glue, synthetic or natural, is used because it makes for a weaker bond. And that way the parts can be separated for repair. At one time it was the only proper glue used for furniture and cabinet making and that's why all the joints used in classic wood work are mechanical in nature and the glue simply stops them from flopping around. It's not all that great a glue. It continues to be used for music instruments where they may need to be taken apart for internal repairs because the weaker more easily broken bond is actually an advantage.

It's also softened with heat so it can be even MORE easily taken apart. And sanding belts get hot in use. So not a good option at all I'd suggest.

Contact cement is also weakened with heat. So I'm a little surprised that it's a good option. A common way to remove plastic laminate like Formica and Arborite and similar that is glued down with contact cement is to use a common iron to heat the laminate and soften the contact cement and then a putty knife to wedge in and lift the laminate. I've done this myself a few times in the past.

[reggie_obe]

There was a sanding belt repair thread in the past. Search should turn it up.

[Joel]

The last thread on repairing belts:
https://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/fo...ng-belt-repair

[Rich Carlstedt]

I bought 300 3M belts at a fire sale years ago and now they are coming apart Adhesive /Age failure I presume.
I read the previous posts and other forums and wish that those who have not actually used the glues- to stop suggesting them !
So last year I tried, contact cements, Shoe Glue, rubber cements and various construction adhesives including a hot melt glue gun product..ALL failed
I did not try the Extreme Packaging Tape yet

I have only had success with Superglue- High Strength stuff, not gap filling ....BUT it takes a procedure , not by just putting glue on the tape
its a longer process, but you clean all surplus adhesive off the belt, then apply the Cyanoacrylate CA glue to the belt , But away from the seam/splice joint (!) with
just enough glue to swege up to the joint - You do not want a surplus at the actual joint ! Put two steel bars ( inside/outside ) the belt and clamp tightly overnight in a vise
If you don't clamp in a vise, it will fail and you want at least 8-12 hours. When you remove the bars, mark the side you just glued with a magic marker on the belt as you will have the other side fail undoubtedly
The reason to minimize the glue "at the splice joint " is to allow the fibers of the tape at the joint to flex- Too much super glue at the point will encase the fibers and all flexing will occur at only one point and the fibers will fail.
Rich

[challenger]

I bought 300 3M belts at a fire sale years ago and now they are coming apart Adhesive /Age failure I presume.
I read the previous posts and other forums and wish that those who have not actually used the glues- to stop suggesting them !
So last year I tried, contact cements, Shoe Glue, rubber cements and various construction adhesives including a hot melt glue gun product..ALL failed
I did not try the Extreme Packaging Tape yet

I have only had success with Superglue- High Strength stuff, not gap filling ....BUT it takes a procedure , not by just putting glue on the tape
its a longer process, but you clean all surplus adhesive off the belt, then apply the Cyanoacrylate CA glue to the belt , But away from the seam/splice joint (!) with
just enough glue to swege up to the joint - You do not want a surplus at the actual joint ! Put two steel bars ( inside/outside ) the belt and clamp tightly overnight in a vise
If you don't clamp in a vise, it will fail and you want at least 8-12 hours. When you remove the bars, mark the side you just glued with a magic marker on the belt as you will have the other side fail undoubtedly
The reason to minimize the glue "at the splice joint " is to allow the fibers of the tape at the joint to flex- Too much super glue at the point will encase the fibers and all flexing will occur at only one point and the fibers will fail.
Rich

You mention tape but what kind?

[darryl]

From what I've seen, belts are taped together with some kind of purple or bluish tape. Yes, I've seen belts come apart from age. We've had belts that were old stock, never used, fail at the join.

I wonder if Kapton tape would work well enough? Never tried it.

Guessing here now, but I wonder if a flexible epoxy would do the job? Like any adhesive, I'm sure it would require a full removal of previous adhesive, and a roughing up of the surfaces to give some bite to the new adhesive. There is possibly a surface prep fluid that would help- some method of chemically etching the surfaces to be glued.

I might suggest contacting Klingspoor, or Norton, or one of the other manufacturers for advice- though I doubt they'd want to tell you-

[Rich Carlstedt]

You mention tape but what kind?

In the previous thread, someone mentioned that 3 Ms ' Extreme packaging Tape works.
I have not seen that tape in the stores yet , but will try it if I find it.

Forgot to mention in my above article to use wax paper between the steel bars and the belt in case some glue seeps out
Rich

[portlandRon]

I am the one that suggested the Extreme packing tape.
It is easy and fast and does hold for a time but I have had it fail.
Seems to happen more in the summer then winter.
Switched to using Tyvek and contact glue and it's lasting until the belt is worn out.

[Rich Carlstedt]

Ron
How big a piece of Tyvek are you using , and which contact cement if possible ?
I have to believe that a thermoset adhesive (iron on) would be the best from a time point of view compared to the Super Glue process I mentioned
but have not found that one yet
Rich

[reggie_obe]

In the previous thread, someone mentioned that 3 Ms ' Extreme packaging Tape works.
I have not seen that tape in the stores yet , but will try it if I find it.

Forgot to mention in my above article to use wax paper between the steel bars and the belt in case some glue seeps out
Rich

Scotch Extreme packing tape at the HomeDepot $9-

[lynnl]

I see that 3M double sided VHB tape is available as thin as .010. Permitted to cure for a few days (gets stronger with age), I would think that would hold.
https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/...alty-tapes.pdf

...Or, if you have small children let them play with the belts after they've had some popsicles or candy or such...

[portlandRon]

The Tyvek is cut a little wider then the belt, trim after clamping.
For one inch and six inch belts I have been overlapping the joint 1" to 1 1/4".
Been using Weldwood contact cement.
Clean off all the old glue with Acetone before applying contact cement.

One of the other things I tries with no luck was iron on cloth patches for clothing.

[Paul Alciatore]

My wood projects sometimes far between each other. So when I buy just two belts of a particular size for my belt sander, I get to use the first one and the second one falls apart when I turn the power on or in the first minute or two of use. This has happened to me several times and I have a number of NOS belts that I don't even try to mount. I am interested in this subject.

You said, "...But away from the seam/splice joint". Could you elaborate a bit more on that? How far away? And does this mean that you are wetting the paper backing of the sandpaper and letting it wick into the joint? You said "swege", whatever that means in this context. It seems that could be a matter of wicking for two or three or more inches which does not seem to be a practical thing. So, just what does this mean?

A photo would be great.

PS: I did purchase one of those cute, Grizzly 1" belt sanders along with five or six belts. Those no name, imported belts have lasted longer in storage than any of my "name brand" ones for other sanders. Go figure!

I bought 300 3M belts at a fire sale years ago and now they are coming apart Adhesive /Age failure I presume.
I read the previous posts and other forums and wish that those who have not actually used the glues- to stop suggesting them !
So last year I tried, contact cements, Shoe Glue, rubber cements and various construction adhesives including a hot melt glue gun product..ALL failed
I did not try the Extreme Packaging Tape yet

I have only had success with Superglue- High Strength stuff, not gap filling ....BUT it takes a procedure , not by just putting glue on the tape
its a longer process, but you clean all surplus adhesive off the belt, then apply the Cyanoacrylate CA glue to the belt , But away from the seam/splice joint (!) with
just enough glue to swege up to the joint - You do not want a surplus at the actual joint ! Put two steel bars ( inside/outside ) the belt and clamp tightly overnight in a vise
If you don't clamp in a vise, it will fail and you want at least 8-12 hours. When you remove the bars, mark the side you just glued with a magic marker on the belt as you will have the other side fail undoubtedly
The reason to minimize the glue "at the splice joint " is to allow the fibers of the tape at the joint to flex- Too much super glue at the point will encase the fibers and all flexing will occur at only one point and the fibers will fail.
Rich

[darryl]

I read an article on 3M tape adhesives. From that I gleaned that most items they sell do not use the strongest adhesive they make. Perhaps that 'superior' packing tape does use something better. I'd guess too that the tape itself is stronger in tension- I wonder what is the difference in the material. Of course I also wonder about what you're sticking it to- no point in a strong adhesive and tape if it's just going to rip away what you're sticking it to.

Ok, Scotch Extreme packing tape- the extreme comes with reinforcing fibers and stronger adhesive- perhaps the tape itself is not anything better-