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  • Originally posted by RB211 View Post
    So now I have Covid cough, and is hard to hold in a deep breath. Apparently I am through the worse of it, but just like last time, will take a long time to get over.
    It's a double edged sword being a critical infrastructure worker. Make good money but more risks are taken and allowed to keep the economy going. What would of prevented me from getting Covid would also mean shutting down my job.
    So just in case there are still doubters here, yes, you can get Covid more than once, and you can get Covid on an airplane.
    So either I quit my job and go into poverty, or play Russian Roulette until I can get vaccinated. Lovely choices.
    There is a third option, quit your job, self quarantine at home....and get it anyway.
    I just need one more tool,just one!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by RB211 View Post
      So now I have Covid cough, and is hard to hold in a deep breath. Apparently I am through the worse of it, but just like last time, will take a long time to get over.
      It's a double edged sword being a critical infrastructure worker. Make good money but more risks are taken and allowed to keep the economy going. What would of prevented me from getting Covid would also mean shutting down my job.
      So just in case there are still doubters here, yes, you can get Covid more than once, and you can get Covid on an airplane.
      So either I quit my job and go into poverty, or play Russian Roulette until I can get vaccinated. Lovely choices.
      I hope you can find a way to get vaccinated quickly. There are sources available in the States now. Your doctor might be able to prescribe a dose based on your job. In the meantime, hope you continue to get better.

      Dan
      At the end of the project, there is a profound difference between spare parts and left over parts.

      Location: SF East Bay.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by wierdscience View Post

        "Stopping the spread" or "slowing the spread" are two of the biggest lies ever told. Once it's in the environment there is no stopping it. It was identified very early on who the high risk groups are. Instead of focusing on isolating them, we were goaded by the media and various political interests into locking down the whole world and wrapping everyone in bubble wrap. The knock on effects of the lockdowns will be worse than the disease.
        China did it. New Zealand did it. Australia is doing well with it. They did it how we tried to do it. But we did not try very hard, because we could have done it in 6 weeks if we had gone in full tilt, instead of taking just enough half measures to mess up the economy, but not enough to actually do anything toward cutting back the disease.

        We would be only a little worse off disease-wise if we had done NOTHING We appeased the people who squalled and said "we WON'T do that", instead of kicking ass hard for a shorter time as china etc did.

        And the china deal is not just from chicom official sources. I have other sources inside.

        It's all buying time until vaccines are out. And until covid mutates into a form that does not kill so many hosts, as colds and 'flu have.

        The US did not so so well compared to china or new Zealand. Overall it kinda depends on what you are willing to tolerate in death rate to preserve the economy. We did not cut the case rate, and we did not preserve the economy. The worst of both worlds.

        And it depends on what you claim would have killed a person "soon regardless"... The one death I know about is a person who was overweight, but otherwise healthy, non-diabetic, 67 y/o, no reason to expect to die anytime soon. It took covid 4 weeks to kill her despite the doctors. And covid DID kill her, no arguing that one.

        The thing about arguing comorbidities etc, is that you have NO idea in most cases whether the person would have lived 20 days more, or 20 years more. Not unless you know exactly when you will yourself die. You have to go with probabilities.

        Ultimately, you have a lot of folks who may not have been well, but were not expected to die very soon. They got covid, and died in 2 to 4weeks, with the symptoms of covid getting worse all the time. Did they die of a bolt from the blue? Nope, they died of covid.

        When Walmart Pharmacies have vaccines, maybe we will get something done. The states are totally incompetent.
        2801 3147 6749 8779 4900 4900 4900

        Keep eye on ball.
        Hashim Khan


        It's just a box of rain, I don't know who put it there.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

          China did it. New Zealand did it. Australia is doing well with it. They did it how we tried to do it. But we did not try very hard, because we could have done it in 6 weeks if we had gone in full tilt, instead of taking just enough half measures to mess up the economy, but not enough to actually do anything toward cutting back the disease.
          NZ is a bit speciality as they don't have too much neighbors. But many SE-Asian countries have been doing remarkably well despite close proximity to China(Thailand, Cambodia, Laos)
          Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe

          Comment


          • I posted here before, got my shot at Walgreens this last Monday. They have it wonderfully organized, yet the state of Iowa is PAYING Microsoft to write a program to handle the State program!! My wife got hers yesterday at CVS they are organized. Key is go online and get membership at both and keep trying.

            Both the States and US Government are in the way!!
            Retired - Journeyman Refrigeration Pipefitter - Master Electrician - Fine Line Automation CNC 4x4 Router

            Comment


            • Originally posted by wmgeorge View Post
              Both the States and US Government are in the way!!
              That seems to be the case of anything they try to do. :-)
              ...lew...

              Comment


              • Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

                China did it. New Zealand did it. Australia is doing well with it. They did it how we tried to do it. But we did not try very hard, because we could have done it in 6 weeks if we had gone in full tilt, instead of taking just enough half measures to mess up the economy, but not enough to actually do anything toward cutting back the disease.

                We would be only a little worse off disease-wise if we had done NOTHING We appeased the people who squalled and said "we WON'T do that", instead of kicking ass hard for a shorter time as china etc did.

                And the china deal is not just from chicom official sources. I have other sources inside.

                It's all buying time until vaccines are out. And until covid mutates into a form that does not kill so many hosts, as colds and 'flu have.

                The US did not so so well compared to china or new Zealand. Overall it kinda depends on what you are willing to tolerate in death rate to preserve the economy. We did not cut the case rate, and we did not preserve the economy. The worst of both worlds.

                And it depends on what you claim would have killed a person "soon regardless"... The one death I know about is a person who was overweight, but otherwise healthy, non-diabetic, 67 y/o, no reason to expect to die anytime soon. It took covid 4 weeks to kill her despite the doctors. And covid DID kill her, no arguing that one.

                The thing about arguing comorbidities etc, is that you have NO idea in most cases whether the person would have lived 20 days more, or 20 years more. Not unless you know exactly when you will yourself die. You have to go with probabilities.

                Ultimately, you have a lot of folks who may not have been well, but were not expected to die very soon. They got covid, and died in 2 to 4weeks, with the symptoms of covid getting worse all the time. Did they die of a bolt from the blue? Nope, they died of covid.

                When Walmart Pharmacies have vaccines, maybe we will get something done. The states are totally incompetent.
                NZ and Australia have geography on their side, China says they did it, but they didn't, they lied about that too and unfortunately lockdowns became the norm despite the fact that they don't have the intended effect.
                https://gbdeclaration.org/
                We are paying a terrible cost for that deception after receiving no benefit. Killing roaches by burning the house down isn't a viable strategy.
                I just need one more tool,just one!

                Comment


                • One of the reasons that the UK has such a large CO19 death rate so far is that we are a world travel hub. Our government bumbles along changing their minds all the time on how the problem is to be addressed, but I don't blame them for the difficult decisions they are faced with. I wouldn't be so happy if I were a US citizen.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by wierdscience View Post

                    NZ and Australia have geography on their side, China says they did it, but they didn't, they lied about that too and unfortunately lockdowns became the norm despite the fact that they don't have the intended effect.
                    https://gbdeclaration.org/
                    We are paying a terrible cost for that deception after receiving no benefit. Killing roaches by burning the house down isn't a viable strategy.
                    The US has geography on its side also. We are a long way from china. All we are connected to is Canada and Mexico. With a reasonable co-operation with the two, and some semblance of an incoming quarantine, it did not have to be as it is now.

                    China is doing better than you say. I have info from inside that says so. They do not have the shutdowns etc. They DID, but made them actually stick, not tolerating quarantine breakers and mask refusers as the US has. We pay the price for coddling the mask refusing snowflakes, china does fine by enforcing the rules.

                    China tried denying the whole thing, and it did not work too well, so they clamped down and got it done.

                    As long as there are such things as airplanes and boats, nobody can hide behind geography. The UK is an island also..... they did not do much better than the US.

                    The virus has an incubation time, and a duration. Lock down fully for longer than that, and it fails to spread. It should take about 6 weeks. Contact trace, enforce masks and quarantine (quarante giorni) and stop even citizens from coming back from overseas and walking around freely spreading disease....quarantine them and do not take no for an answer.

                    Instead, the US did the economically bad parts of the lockdown, but totally failed at pretty much every single one of the medically required parts. As I said, the very worst combination possible, prolonging the pain as long as possible.....smart.🙄

                    New Zealand and Australia enforce quarantine, they contact trace, they enforce masks...... all the things the US indignantly refused to do. and they pretty much have it licked.
                    Last edited by J Tiers; 02-12-2021, 11:38 AM.
                    2801 3147 6749 8779 4900 4900 4900

                    Keep eye on ball.
                    Hashim Khan


                    It's just a box of rain, I don't know who put it there.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by wierdscience View Post
                      ..........Killing roaches by burning the house down isn't a viable strategy.
                      No, but what is a viable strategy would be to totally close the house down and fumigate it instead of trying to continue along as if all the roaches would disappear if you just ignore them long enough.
                      Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by wierdscience View Post

                        NZ and Australia have geography on their side, China says they did it, but they didn't, they lied about that too and unfortunately lockdowns became the norm despite the fact that they don't have the intended effect.

                        We are paying a terrible cost for that deception after receiving no benefit. Killing roaches by burning the house down isn't a viable strategy.
                        While I can't prove anything, may I add a data point to counter your assertion? Given 8 households that I'm related to, 4 of us are following the quarantine guidelines and 4 are not. Three of the families who did not follow the rules, all have been infected. Of the 4 that are following the rules strictly... Zero infections. That may well be coincidence, seeing as how those 8 families are separated by hundreds or thousands of miles.

                        Now I'm not saying that isolation and sanitation are the only possible solutions, but until you get a vaccine that works and cures that work, it's much better than getting sick and discovering next year that you are one of the "lucky" ones who recovered quickly but now have permanent heart damage from it.

                        I'm lucky. I have a slew of minor medical problems, some of which could become big problems if I contract the virus.

                        Dan

                        At the end of the project, there is a profound difference between spare parts and left over parts.

                        Location: SF East Bay.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by danlb View Post

                          While I can't prove anything, may I add a data point to counter your assertion? Given 8 households that I'm related to, 4 of us are following the quarantine guidelines and 4 are not. Three of the families who did not follow the rules, all have been infected. Of the 4 that are following the rules strictly... Zero infections. That may well be coincidence, seeing as how those 8 families are separated by hundreds or thousands of miles.

                          Now I'm not saying that isolation and sanitation are the only possible solutions, but until you get a vaccine that works and cures that work, it's much better than getting sick and discovering next year that you are one of the "lucky" ones who recovered quickly but now have permanent heart damage from it.

                          I'm lucky. I have a slew of minor medical problems, some of which could become big problems if I contract the virus.

                          Dan
                          Dan, from the papers and studies I have been reading it's still a crap shoot as to who gets it. A large and growing percentage of the population has had the virus and zero response to it. The next largest group have had it and reported mild symptoms, the third group have had it and suffered flu symptoms, the fourth group required hospitalization and the smallest group died. Included in the last two are a bunch of people who wore masks and followed the rules and still got sick. This is partly due to the numerous studies that show masks are at best less than 5% effective at reducing viral transmission even with influenza.

                          https://swprs.org/face-masks-evidence/

                          From the CDC- https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

                          "In our systematic review, we identified 10 RCTs that reported estimates of the effectiveness of face masks in reducing laboratory-confirmed influenza virus infections in the community from literature published during 1946–July 27, 2018. In pooled analysis, we found no significant reduction in influenza transmission with the use of face masks (RR 0.78, 95% CI 0.51–1.20; I2 = 30%, p = 0.25)

                          Yet the public has been led to believe that face masks will protect them from the virus. Is it possible that what the experts are really going for is old fashioned herd immunity and they aren't telling us? Why give people that false sense of security otherwise? It also doesn't build confidence in mask mandate policy that more than a few politicians and experts that have been brow beating everyone for months about wearing masks and not visiting family etc, etc have been caught red handed in a private restaurant with 50 or so friends and family and not a mask in sight.

                          Interesting also in that CDC link on influenza transmission. Frequent handwashing including under the nails is 35-46% effective at preventing spread. The only real value the masks have is catching droplets from a sneeze or cough, but sneezing into your elbow works too.

                          So yes, I would consider it random luck and given your issues I would be very careful to avoid people and not trust a mask, even a "good" one.

                          I just need one more tool,just one!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by wierdscience View Post

                            "Stopping the spread" or "slowing the spread" are two of the biggest lies ever told. Once it's in the environment there is no stopping it. It was identified very early on who the high risk groups are. Instead of focusing on isolating them, we were goaded by the media and various political interests into locking down the whole world and wrapping everyone in bubble wrap. The knock on effects of the lockdowns will be worse than the disease.
                            You're really fond of using the words deception and lies. You seem to be saying that the scientific community of every country is doing it wrong.
                            I agree that there have been many mistakes made but also believe that many of the those mistakes are being made from people that think they
                            know better than the scientists. I acknowledge that your sources are from the science community, but seem to suggest that it is being ignored.

                            Here in Ca restrictions are entirely based on the numbers. If an area has good numbers restrictions are minimal, if the numbers are bad they are locked down.
                            John Titor, when are you.

                            Comment


                            • If wearing of masks is medically useless, why do they wear them in hospitals?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by old mart View Post
                                If wearing of masks is medically useless, why do they wear them in hospitals?
                                It's a fashion statement - and also a sign of professionalism so they can charge you an extra 40 bucks for things like toothpicks or a cotton swab (size small of course)

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