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  • CTD saw restoration

    One down two more to go. Picked up three of these and twenty new carbide blades before they got tossed into the dumpster. Didn't take that much to restore. Just a few new bolts, belts and time. Found a good video on YT about programming the Chinese Huanyang VFD which was a big easy after that. 3 phase motors. Funny what companies will just throw out after never maintaining their equipment, just easier/cheaper I suppose. Plan on adding a coolant mist system so will be able to cut anything from 50rpm to 3450. These are three grand new.

    Click image for larger version

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  • #2
    Looks great, nice job. A+ on saving them from the dumpster.

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    • #3
      Brick saw ? ? ?

      -D
      DZER

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Doozer View Post
        Brick saw ? ? ?

        -D
        Metal cold saws or bricks if push comes to shove!

        https://www.ctdsaw.com/ Click image for larger version

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        • #5
          Very nice work! Looks like one of their chop saws. With the speed reduction from the VFD and coolant it should work nicely as a cold saw. Do you plan to make a vise or vises?
          It's all mind over matter.
          If you don't mind, it don't matter.

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          • #6
            I don't see any gearbox speed reduction,
            which is why cold saw never entered my mind.
            I don't think just adding a VFD is going to make
            it work, as you need torque to push a cold saw
            blade. Hence all the cold saws I have ever seen
            have a worm gear reduction box. That is why
            I thought it was a masonry saw. Also, masonry
            saws don't have vices either. Hence my confusion.

            -Doozer
            DZER

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Doozer View Post
              I don't see any gearbox speed reduction,
              which is why cold saw never entered my mind.
              I don't think just adding a VFD is going to make
              it work, as you need torque to push a cold saw
              blade. Hence all the cold saws I have ever seen
              have a worm gear reduction box. That is why
              I thought it was a masonry saw. Also, masonry
              saws don't have vices either. Hence my confusion.

              -Doozer
              Yes. And also yes on the why-no-vise. This is not a cold saw. The CTD website has a series of Ferrous Metal saws which this is not one of (they slow to 55 or 110 blade rpm's). This is one of their Chop Saws. Blade RPM 3700. The user manual describes using this for cutting wood, aluminum, and using an abrasive blade.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Bob Engelhardt View Post

                Yes. And also yes on the why-no-vise. This is not a cold saw. The CTD website has a series of Ferrous Metal saws which this is not one of (they slow to 55 or 110 blade rpm's). This is one of their Chop Saws. Blade RPM 3700. The user manual describes using this for cutting wood, aluminum, and using an abrasive blade.
                Except that with a Sensorless Vector VFD I have variable speed control with no torque loss at low RPM. As explained to me by the VRF guru that with these SV VFDs you only have a torque loss ABOVE the motors rated RPM. Now I am no VFD guy whatsoever but right now I am cutting solid 3" round 7075 aluminum at 100rpm with a bit more pressure than normal with no noticeable RPM loss. I will next try some cold roll when I get it all set up but so far so good. I would guess that a geared cold saw would actually be cheaper to manufacture and more reliable than selling them with VFDs so they go full mechanical for that reason. We primarily cut aluminum and will use the full 3450 rated rpm for that but being able to cut some ferrious every now and again will be nice. This is better than a rotary phase with no speed control I believe.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Doozer View Post
                  I don't see any gearbox speed reduction,
                  which is why cold saw never entered my mind.
                  I don't think just adding a VFD is going to make
                  it work, as you need torque to push a cold saw
                  blade. Hence all the cold saws I have ever seen
                  have a worm gear reduction box. That is why
                  I thought it was a masonry saw. Also, masonry
                  saws don't have vices either. Hence my confusion.

                  -Doozer
                  Except that with a Sensorless Vector VFD I have variable speed control with no/little torque loss at low RPM. As explained to me by the VRF guru that with these SV VFDs you only have a torque loss ABOVE the motors rated RPM. Now I am no VFD guy whatsoever but right now I am cutting solid 3" round 7075 aluminum at 100rpm with a bit more pressure than normal with no noticeable RPM loss. I will next try some cold roll when I get it all set up but so far so good. I would guess that a geared cold saw would actually be cheaper to manufacture and more reliable than selling them with VFDs so they go full mechanical for that reason. We primarily cut aluminum and will use the full 3450 rated rpm for that but being able to cut some ferrous every now and again will be nice. This is better than a rotary phase with no speed control I believe.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by MrWhoopee View Post
                    Very nice work! Looks like one of their chop saws. With the speed reduction from the VFD and coolant it should work nicely as a cold saw. Do you plan to make a vise or vises?
                    Thanks and yes either make or adapt one. Will have to give it a tink on the best way but I tink like have half a vise somehow bolted to the moveable table.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by vectorwarbirds View Post

                      Except that with a Sensorless Vector VFD I have variable speed control with no torque loss at low RPM. ... right now I am cutting solid 3" round 7075 aluminum at 100rpm with a bit more pressure than normal with no noticeable RPM loss. ...
                      Well, that's something. With aluminum you could dial up the RPM, but you know that.

                      I would guess that a geared cold saw would actually be cheaper to manufacture and more reliable than selling them with VFDs so they go full mechanical for that reason. ...
                      Actually, a better reason is that by gearing down, the torque is increased. A 3700 RPM motor geared down to 110 will have 3700/110 = 34 times the torque. Minus gear losses.

                      BTW - nobody mentioned it, but 20 new carbide blades for free: you suck!
                      Last edited by Bob Engelhardt; 11-23-2021, 10:29 AM.

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                      • #12
                        You can get dry cut carbide tipped saw blades for steel that handle those RPM's
                        Helder Ferreira
                        Setubal, Portugal

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Bob Engelhardt View Post

                          Well, that's something. With aluminum you could dial up the RPM, but you know that.



                          Actually, a better reason is that by gearing down, the torque is increased. A 3700 RPM motor geared down to 110 will have 3700/110 = 34 times the torque. Minus gear losses.

                          BTW - nobody mentioned it, but 20 new carbide blades for free: you suck!
                          Interesting you mentioned this Bob as the pulley ratio on these is 1:1 and I thought it might be interesting to configure one of the other saws with lower ratios. There is plenty of room for a larger final drive pulley with a larger belt guard. Then use a single phase (these are all 3) 1725 rpm motor instead of the 3450s on these. Having all these blades, which I believe are all for aluminum, is kinda bad suckage as I don't need anything near that number, sell them on ebay I suppose but I never seem to get around to that

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Noitoen View Post
                            You can get dry cut carbide tipped saw blades for steel that handle those RPM's
                            Have you ever used a high speed metal cut off saw with a carbide blade ? ? ? ? ?
                            Very dangerous and extremely loud. One of the more ridiculous products I have seen.
                            It is insane how a product like this even exists. I pity the fools that buy them and have
                            to put up with the noise and what WILL happen if something binds the blade.
                            Freaking ridiculous these saws are. It is not surprising though. Some poorly designed
                            product is promoted through advertising and sold to people who are followers and don't
                            know any better, that could not have an independent thought if forced at gun point.
                            The saving grace with an abrasive blade at high speed, is the blade will fail if something
                            binds up. On a high speed carbide steel blade, if something binds up, metal pieces are
                            going to launch out in every direction. All is happy and gay until something goes wrong.
                            I do not trust cutting steel on essentially what is a wood saw platform at wood saw speeds.
                            You can keep those fancy new saw blades. I can see all too clearly the risks and
                            inconveniences associated with using them to cut steel.

                            -=---Doozer
                            DZER

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                            • #15
                              Know a company with a 15 hp motor driving a 600mm blade cutting round tubing all day long. Cutting 50mm x 1.5mm wall tube takes less than 0,5 seconds.
                              Helder Ferreira
                              Setubal, Portugal

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