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  • #46
    Originally posted by The Artful Bodger View Post
    Oh dear! Now I feel so intimidated!
    Oh don't be that's just being silly --- just grab about a 3' cheater bar and you'll do just fine lol

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    • #47
      Sad to see people having to work in such conditions. Especially young ones. I would not be surprised if they make much more than a dollar a day. I was shocked at the lack of any PPE at the plating section of the plant.( well they did have some rubber gloves).
      Just for kicks, I looked up some similar tools on Amazon: vuxcell 1/2" Drive Socket Breaker L Shape Extension Bar Wrench, made in China and sells of about $15. Heck, I would ;not be surprised if the ones in the video was being made for China who in turn ships them to the USA.
      The tools in the video could not be made of metal very hard,l as they was drawn through that extruding fixture and no tempering afterword.
      _____________________________________________

      I would rather have tools that I never use, than not have a tool I need.
      Oregon Coast

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      • #48
        Originally posted by The Artful Bodger View Post
        Oh dear! Now I feel so intimidated!
        AKB is showing you the "booming" part. of his screen name.

        Has nothing to do with the facts, but then it was not intended to.

        I'm impressed.... he can tell what it is made of, what the alloy is, and all the rest without ever touching it, from a cell phone video. You gotta be GOOD to do that..... remote sensing metallurgy!

        And it looks like he got the size wrong.... Those kids doing the plating operation.....they were grabbing 7 or so at a time (you can count them at 14:41 in the video), so probably not 3/4" diameter rod..... looks like around 7/16" or 1/2" maybe. Which would make those 3/8" drive (yes, apparently a lot of metric stuff overseas uses inch drive squares).

        But a pretty substantial toggle press to bend those even so...

        The processes are crudely done, the plating is just not even close to being halfway non-hazardous. You'd not expect them to be very good, but the point is that none of us "KNOW" what the alloy is, or anything else about the parts.

        It does look like a reasonably substantial reduction in the drawing operation, which has to work harden the material. How much? We don't know, and for sure AKB does not.

        The wrenches probably function OK for what they are intended to do, at least as far as the strength is concerned. You've got to add parts.... hammer, piece of pipe, etc, to get any heavy leverage on a small wrench.

        As to how long the retaining ball will stay in... that's a question. I doubt that hammer staking is super good. I've had them pop out of stuff that looked better staked than the hammer is likely to do.
        Last edited by J Tiers; 01-02-2022, 07:13 PM.
        CNC machines only go through the motions

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        • #49
          In the absence of manufacturers suggestions or hard data ::

          My method is to look up what is the max torque of the given fastener I am likely to use with a given tool. Usually a fastener torque chart with the proof loads, clamp loads, etc. for a given grade and size. And then try to get a tool that is well within the elastic range i.e. will not yield. If anything yields then it goes in the scrap bin. Depending on the type of part, and the location of the fastener, the desired torque could be less.

          At work we are required to adhere to given torque figures for guarantee and public liability reasons.
          25 miles north of Buffalo NY, USA

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          • #50
            Originally posted by J Tiers View Post


            I'm impressed.... he can tell what it is made of, what the alloy is, and all the rest without ever touching it, from a cell phone video. You gotta be GOOD to do that..... remote sensing metallurgy!
            I did not state that - and nobody else did "WE" just noted the material is not hardened --- got it? it's at least not hardened to "normal even run of the mill decent wrench material"

            get that through your thick head,,, it's about hardening - nothing else - nobody's making any other claims of "alloys"


            The wrenches probably function OK for what they are intended to do, at least as far as the strength is concerned.
            I stated that same thing - what do you want for the money? would go great in the trunk of a car or someone that does not do much half inch drive stuff but wants a starter kit with some cheap sockets - again "what do you want for the money....

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            • #51
              None of that even matters.
              What matters is that the tool failed.
              He could see that, and conclude that it was made of inferior materials in an un-controlled process.
              Very likely he would be right, without needing to know all the specifics.

              Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

              AKB is showing you the "booming" part. of his screen name.

              I'm impressed.... he can tell what it is made of, what the alloy is, and all the rest without ever touching it, from a cell phone video. You gotta be GOOD to do that..... remote sensing metallurgy!
              25 miles north of Buffalo NY, USA

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by nickel-city-fab View Post
                ...........
                What matters is that the tool failed.
                ......................
                The tool failed? What tool failed?

                He tested one of those while he was there?

                'Course the alloy and so forth matters. The drawing work-hardens it as well as straightening it. Not every alloy would react well.

                The point is not whether the tool is OK or not.

                The point is that nobody "knows" from the video whether the tool is OK or not, whether it is "cheese" or not. It might BE cheese, but you can't tell that from the video.

                All you can do is guess. Or say... "it's from Pakistan and so it can't be any good."

                If the place did not look like a dump, and there were no child laborers, if it looked clean, but the same stuff was being done in a more "pretty" factory process, far fewer people would say the product is junk.

                Last edited by J Tiers; 01-02-2022, 07:48 PM.
                CNC machines only go through the motions

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

                  The tool failed? What tool failed?

                  He tested one of those while he was there?

                  'Course the alloy and so forth matters. The drawing work-hardens it as well as straightening it. Not every alloy would react well.

                  The point is not whether the tool is OK or not.

                  The point is that nobody "knows" from the video whether the tool is OK or not, whether it is "cheese" or not. It might BE cheese, but you can't tell that from the video.

                  All you can do is guess. Or say... "it's from Pakistan and so it can't be any good."

                  If the place did not look like a dump, and there were no child laborers, if it looked clean, but the same stuff was being done in a more "pretty" factory process, far fewer people would say the product is junk.
                  Duh - again right over your head - a few people who do know what hardened metal does when being bent at a 90 degree angle ON A DIME chimed in and stated the tool was not hardened --- and then you stepped in and said

                  "Basically, you have absolutely no idea what hardness the bar they have is at when they get it, or after the cold stretching/straightening process. So those complaining literally have no idea what they are talking about."

                  and then I stepped in and stated your analogy was way off since the bar was bent at a 90 on a dime AFTER all your claims of what "might make it hard"

                  so your point is moot, you are the one that does not have a clue - others chime in and tell you as to why and you just say "uh uhh because you did not take a rockwell scale to it"


                  They don't have too - the material is "soft and pliable" it may very well be hardened and in fact as hard as they can actually get it for what it is - which in that case would be low carbon steel ----- but does not matter if it has more potential or is maxed out - THE MATERIAL IS NOT HARD.

                  Once again you overstepped your boundaries with what you know - others spanked you and told you why, accept it and try to learn...

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by A.K. Boomer View Post

                    They don't have too - the material is "soft and pliable" it may very well be hardened and in fact as hard as they can actually get it for what it is - which in that case would be low carbon steel ----- but does not matter if it has more potential or is maxed out - THE MATERIAL IS NOT HARD.

                    Once again you overstepped your boundaries with what you know - others spanked you and told you why, accept it and try to learn...
                    Boomer, I think you're right, but I also think you're taking this WAY too personal, and I think both of you should just let it go.
                    It's one thing to beat a dead horse, and it's another thing to turn it into nano particles.
                    25 miles north of Buffalo NY, USA

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by nickel-city-fab View Post

                      Boomer, I think you're right, but I also think you're taking this WAY too personal, and I think both of you should just let it go.
                      It's one thing to beat a dead horse, and it's another thing to turn it into nano particles.
                      Thanks - I needed that, im done - promise...

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Sigh..................Sorry, pal, nobody "spanked me", and it is not "obviously wrong"......

                        Just because something is ":hardened", does not mean it will break if you bend it. Just get USED to that. And "bending" in a multi-ton press is not equal to "failure" in use by hand.

                        As far as I am concerned, the part can be junk and I don't care. It does not matter. Personally, I think it is likely no better than it has to be, if even that good, and is not made right, but that is an opinion, and not relevant.

                        Point here is that all YOU know about it is that a multi-ton toggle press can bend it. And, if you paid attention, that it has been work hardened "some amount" by drawing it through a die. The WAY it bent has some relevance also, if you look closely, but never mind that.

                        You ASSUME it is junk and dead soft. Possibly because it is a dirty, unsafe Pakistani factory, possibly because it bent in a press and did not break

                        But your assumption cannot be proven. Yet you INSIST that everything you "assume" is actually an absolute fact.

                        If you did not make absolute statements about how it definitely "is" cheese, I'd not see a problem with your comments. Opinions are one thing, stating things as a fact when you have no way of knowing, is just silly, and in this case, prejudiced. It may be useless cheese, but you cannotn "prove" it.

                        The issue here is that you cannot "know" what you nevertheless claim to be an absolute fact. It's just pure nonsense to state "facts" that you do not know ARE facts.

                        And then to "argue your point by talking about "spanking", and "in over your head" etc, etc". Arguing "against the man" and not using facts against the opposing argument (going "ad hominem"), which usually means that you cannot make a factual argument. That does you no good at all.
                        CNC machines only go through the motions

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                        • #57
                          Is there a contest running here to see who can post the most YouTube links? Seems like every other thread lately is a link with no explanation and/or somebody fishing for views on their page

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Captain K View Post
                            Is there a contest running here to see who can post the most YouTube links? Seems like every other thread lately is a link with no explanation and/or somebody fishing for views on their page
                            If you are referring to the topic I posted today about useful thing made from junque then please consider yourself advised the youtube story is not mine. Thank you.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Seems they make Brick trowels from the wheel center punch slugs-

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJ02oBldHOc

                              But they have to be junk, cause the trowels don't conform to ASTM material specs right???
                              I just need one more tool,just one!

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Bodger
                                No, I wasn't refering to yours specifically.
                                Last edited by Captain K; 01-02-2022, 09:33 PM.

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