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Getting those toolmaker quality chamfers on parts......how?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

    Not derisive of hand filing in general. Derisive of MY abilities.. And "questioning" of others claims, pending seeing their work.

    .
    Machinists are not the only ones who bevel an edge. Look at the workmanship here, they describe the techniques in a series of articles with beautiful pics:
    https://monochrome-watches.com/a-tec...te-horlogerie/

    MOSTLY done by hand. Very expensive hands. Scrolling down the article for close-up pics, they call the technique "anglage" and name some of the worlds best practicioners.
    25 miles north of Buffalo NY, USA

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    • #32
      Many times we think of deburring (which includes chamfering) of parts as a job for inexperienced noobs in the shop. In my area where there's lots of aerospace I know of a couple shops that specialize in this type work. They understand what is acceptable for critical structural parts.

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      • #33
        If I was intending to produce perfect chamfers, I woulf mill them and then hand file the machine marks off as necessary. If I had a job or tool made by the toolmakers, it would be perfect in application and also cosmetically superb, a matter of pride in their skills.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by The Metal Butcher View Post

          Perhaps you care too much?
          'Ow much is too much, eh?

          Sometimes you want the thing to look very good and work well. Sometimes it only has to work well.

          Choose wisely.
          4357 2773 5150 9120 9135 8645 1007 1190 2133 9120 5942

          Keep eye on ball.
          Hashim Khan

          Everything not impossible is compulsory

          "There's no pleasing these serpents"......Lewis Carroll

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          • #35
            One example of chamfering parts in the Haas tip of the day: https://youtu.be/43wlD8WWsKk?t=316

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            • #36
              Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

              Putting a good 45 degree by 0.0625 wide chamfer on an edge, that does not have any "wiggles" when sighted along, and looks and even measures the same all around the part? Not in my skill set.

              .
              Its a basic milling operation. First you have to qualify the dimensions of your chamfer cutter accurately, from there is just simple offsets on the workpiece. Of course accurate measurements of the workpiece and edge finding all plays into the finished result just as any milling operation. It will produce a dimensionally chamfer within tolerance, certainly without wiggles unless the milling machine is totally wore out or the operator has trouble hitting dimensions accurately. .

              Files, sanding and similar methods are fine to just break a sharp edge but when a exact chamfer dimension has to be made (without wiggles of course), its a basic milling operation.

              Here is a video that describes the process well, no magic or mirrors involved. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h88dytFyqAk&t=778s

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Sparky_NY View Post
                ...It will produce a dimensionally chamfer within tolerance, certainly without wiggles unless the milling machine is totally wore out or the operator has trouble hitting dimensions accurately...
                Not true in practice using manual machines with ordinary wear. Machining will impart a surface finish that is anything but smooth. Even the images near the end of your linked video confirm this.
                12" x 35" Logan 2557V lathe
                Index "Super 55" mill
                18" Vectrax vertical bandsaw
                7" x 10" Vectrax mitering bandsaw
                24" State disc sander

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by ezduzit View Post

                  Not true in practice using manual machines with ordinary wear. Machining will impart a surface finish that is anything but smooth. Even the images near the end of your linked video confirm this.
                  What you are describing is a machine that is worn such that it can not produce a good surface finish. That "should" not be considered ordinary wear.

                  Manual or cnc does not matter. Getting a good surface finish on any milling operation is another subject, of course the condition of the machine plays a big part, that World War 2 era machine might not be up to a good surface finish. Climb milling and cutting lube play a big part also of course.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by ezduzit View Post

                    Not true in practice using manual machines with ordinary wear. Machining will impart a surface finish that is anything but smooth. Even the images near the end of your linked video confirm this.
                    And there you have it...... Yes, the finish on his 0.100 chamfer sucks so badly it would get a bowling ball through a pinhole. Even when he went slowly.

                    Th CNC video looked better, but I never got a good look at the surface with the light in a bad place as with the Joe Pie video.

                    Whoever suggested the scotchbrite, and the polishing mop, etc.............. That does not seem consistent with having sharply defined edges on the chamfer. Using those things always seems to "dub over" sharply defined edges. Like the difference between the ways on a new lathe, and the ways on an old one..... they become rounded and worn.
                    Last edited by J Tiers; 01-16-2022, 10:19 PM.
                    4357 2773 5150 9120 9135 8645 1007 1190 2133 9120 5942

                    Keep eye on ball.
                    Hashim Khan

                    Everything not impossible is compulsory

                    "There's no pleasing these serpents"......Lewis Carroll

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Rich Carlstedt View Post
                      I don't know about other die shops, but ours had a 12 inch disc sander with the table set at 45 degrees ( Downward )
                      and a 1/2 drill rod horizontal about 3/4" above the table , so when you lay a block on the table, you get a perfect 45 degree chamfer at about .060"
                      You can get the corners too
                      Rich
                      X2 on that Rich,Those Disc Machines work great,I have a 24” and tables tilt 45deg. Up&Down.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by J Tiers View Post

                        And there you have it...... Yes, the finish on his 0.100 chamfer sucks so badly it would get a bowling ball through a pinhole. Even when he went slowly.

                        Th CNC video looked better, but I never got a good look at the surface with the light in a bad place as with the Joe Pie video.

                        Whoever suggested the scotchbrite, and the polishing mop, etc.............. That does not seem consistent with having sharply defined edges on the chamfer. Using those things always seems to "dub over" sharply defined edges. Like the difference between the ways on a new lathe, and the ways on an old one..... they become rounded and worn.
                        Its NOT a .100 chamfer ! The entire V is .125 wide, edge to edge, the flat on the top is .015. As such, the finish is MUCH better than the camera magnification makes it appear. ALL finishes show irregularities under magnification, camera views can be deceiving on such tiny details. The chamfer IS straight and very accurate to dimension. IF the milled finish under magnification is not sufficient then either hand polishing or off to the surface grinder is the next option.

                        The milled chamfer IS accurate to dimension and straight, something that is NOT going to happen with hand filing/sanding a chamfer. The finish on the overall part is likely no better than the milled chamfer anyways.

                        Post a comment on Joe Pie's video, tell him "the finish on his 0.100 chamfer sucks so badly it would get a bowling ball through a pinhole". The response would be quite entertaining.

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                        • #42
                          You should actually watch the whole video, because it is very obvious that you did not.

                          The finish does suck. Not anything I would want if I was doing the chamfers for appearance.

                          He CALLED it a "hundred thousandths chamfer", at about 25:00 in the video.. And it's NOT on the lathe bed of the model, it was on a block he used for a demo.
                          Last edited by J Tiers; 01-17-2022, 12:01 PM.
                          4357 2773 5150 9120 9135 8645 1007 1190 2133 9120 5942

                          Keep eye on ball.
                          Hashim Khan

                          Everything not impossible is compulsory

                          "There's no pleasing these serpents"......Lewis Carroll

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by J Tiers View Post
                            You should actually watch the whole video, because it is very obvious that you did not.

                            The finish does suck. Not anything I would want if I was doing the chamfers for appearance.

                            He CALLED it a "hundred thousandths chamfer", at about 25:00 in the video.. And it's NOT on the lathe bed of the model, it was on a block he used for a demo.
                            The video was aimed at setting the chamfer tool. In another video he shows actually cutting the ways on that lathe, shows the drawing with dimensions etc.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              A link to a DIY internal/external chamfering tool.

                              Similar to several already posted but instead of a ball bearing guide it uses a fixed guide similar to what you'd find on a woodworking pin router.

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtBDId-2AT8

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by genea View Post
                                A link to a DIY internal/external chamfering tool.

                                Similar to several already posted but instead of a ball bearing guide it uses a fixed guide similar to what you'd find on a woodworking pin router.

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtBDId-2AT8
                                Thanks for posting that. Excellent video and tool.
                                12" x 35" Logan 2557V lathe
                                Index "Super 55" mill
                                18" Vectrax vertical bandsaw
                                7" x 10" Vectrax mitering bandsaw
                                24" State disc sander

                                Comment

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