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OT-looking to gather ideas-how to support cantilevered load on horizontal shaft motor

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  • OT-looking to gather ideas-how to support cantilevered load on horizontal shaft motor

    Collectively I would like to pick your brains for suggestions.

    My logsplitter - home built by someone other than me but since modified by me with a larger motor and pump has an issue with the cantilevered load of the pump hanging off of the motor. The easy solution is to have a vertical shaft motor but I am not interested is spending the money for an occasional use machine. The 8 hp motor is from a self propelled snowblower - hence the motor has an additional set of gears added to the output side of the block - that alone adds about 2 1/4 inch of overhang. Next problem is that the crankshaft has step in it and the Lovejoy coupling fits on the smaller dia of the crank which adds another 2 inches of overhang. The motor was mounted using 3/8 SHCS threaded into the block. The forward two fasteners failed - found the bolt heads under the machine. Did not realize the problem until the oil drain pipe (extended from the front of the motor and hard mounted to the same surface as the motor was mounted to) started to leak oil - the drain tube was the only retention on that side of the block and had cracked and was leaking oil. Tube sheared off, in the block, as soon as I touched it.

    So I could:
    1. replace the fasteners every 7 or 8 hrs of run time (I have enough 3/8 UNC SHCS to last me a decade doing this)
    2. Hard mount the housing (aluminum casting) that contains the Lovejoy coupling - see pic with the bronze colored bolt as a place holder - problem I see with this is that any flexing of the motor/coupling housing will all be on the housing and that will fail.
    3. Support (but not secure) the tail end of the coupling housing - this would carry the cantilevered load somewhat but allow the cantilevered load to lift off of the support as the plate the motor is mounted to flexes (assuming that it does). This support could be something like a hard durometer polyurethane or a hard plastic (nylon?) or a aluminum or steel block
    4. Or?

    Click image for larger version  Name:	20220518_114148.jpg Views:	0 Size:	1.52 MB ID:	2001194 Click image for larger version  Name:	20220518_114047.jpg Views:	0 Size:	1.55 MB ID:	2001195 Click image for larger version  Name:	20220518_113836.jpg Views:	0 Size:	1.35 MB ID:	2001196 Click image for larger version  Name:	20220518_115002.jpg Views:	0 Size:	1.21 MB ID:	2001197

    Thanks for reading this far - this forum has such a diverse group of people that create that I hope to tap into their thoughts/observations. TIA.
    Metro Detroit

  • #2
    You can shorten the coupling by using two sprockets face to face and use a double chain to connect them. It will reduce more than half. The pump can also be supported by some type of engine mount
    Helder Ferreira
    Setubal, Portugal

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    • #3
      You may only view thumbnails in this gallery. This gallery has 1 photos.
      Helder Ferreira
      Setubal, Portugal

      Comment


      • #4
        I would be some what suspect of your bolts. I would suggest that you replace them with with ones that are not fully threaded to the head but have a smooth shank that goes through most of the adapter. You may have to buy bolts with a shank and cut the threaded portion to the length you need.

        Are the bolt holes wallered out allowing the adapter to be off center with the motor shaft and the two shafts are out of line?

        Also make sure that your hoses are not adding to the load. Are they the proper length, not pulling on the pump? Are the hoses secured so that they do not vibrate or push/pull on the pump?

        lg
        no neat sig line
        Last edited by larry_g; 05-18-2022, 03:03 PM.
        near Salem OR

        Comment


        • #5
          Well, I don't have a solution to your problem as I am not familiar with your machine, but have to say that you should
          throw away those 3/8" Cap screws and buy GOOD cap screws and not the stuff from Fastenal, hardware stores or eBay .

          You want only Unbrako SHCS for maximum strength ( 180,000 + TS )
          Most likely they were foreign made and were not made to USA standards.
          The closest (but not the same ! ) screws would be from Holo-Krome , Allen, or Camcar - All else is a crap shoot
          Spent years working with these fasteners and testing them .

          Rich
          Green Bay, WI

          Comment


          • #6
            8hp Tecumseh engines are NOT the smoothest or best balanced
            engines out there. I had a few. Make some steel brackets and
            support it to the base flange. Your single jack bolt will just change
            the harmonics of the vibration and will wear quickly.

            -D
            DZER

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Rich Carlstedt View Post
              ..............................................

              You want only Unbrako SHCS for maximum strength ( 180,000 + TS )
              .................
              Rich
              I thought they were recently bought out and "outsourced". Or was that the other brand?

              Misumi bought them out.
              CNC machines only go through the motions

              Comment


              • #8
                Noitoen: Thank you for the image / info on the chain coupler. I was unaware of these. I found a potential source here: https://www.surpluscenter.com/Power-...ge_length=9999

                Rich: I've read your postings about Unbrako SHCS in other threads. My SHCS are of mixed, untraceable lineage - dregs picked up in mixed lot auctions. I think I need to do more than just replacing the fasteners. Without being able to add a counterweight to the opposite side of the motor, I am guessing that if the fasteners did not fail, the mounting ears on the motor would fatigue and fail in time.

                Doozer: The bronze colored bolt was placed there before taking the pic - a pointer to where I was considering placing a support - with the consideration of either a rigid metal support or something with some compliance. After your comment I realized that I did not post the image without the pointer. Agree that Tecumseh motors are shakers.

                J Tiers: Unbrako was bought out by Deepack (India) in '08. Guessing if there was a problem with the fastener quality since, it would be noted somewhere.
                Metro Detroit

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'm curious about the chain coupler: what is its advantage over a solid coupler? Does it allow some misalignment?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Bob Engelhardt View Post
                    I'm curious about the chain coupler: what is its advantage over a solid coupler? Does it allow some misalignment?
                    It works quite well. There is the normal play of a regular chain to sprocket that is enough for most cases. In the Surpluscenter page mentioned earlier, there is a version with a 2 piece yellow cover so that you can lubricate the chains.
                    Helder Ferreira
                    Setubal, Portugal

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I had an 8hp Tecky on a birt dike that shook so much
                      that it kept cracking the steel gas tank bracket.
                      I think I welded it 3 times.

                      --D
                      DZER

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Noitoen View Post

                        It works quite well. There is the normal play of a regular chain to sprocket that is enough for most cases. In the Surpluscenter page mentioned earlier, there is a version with a 2 piece yellow cover so that you can lubricate the chains.
                        Yes, Lubricate the chains or else you will get fretting corrosion.

                        -D
                        DZER

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Here is an application where I had to replace an electric gear motor that wore out the slew bearing and gear by an hydraulic motor with chain and sprocket. The motor was to fragile to receive the drive sprocket so, I used the double chain coupling to extend the shaft of a suitable dimension and use a pillow block bearing to take the load. That is a 20 HP hydraulic motor.
                          You may only view thumbnails in this gallery. This gallery has 5 photos.
                          Helder Ferreira
                          Setubal, Portugal

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by J Tiers View Post
                            I thought they were recently bought out and "outsourced". Or was that the other brand? Misumi bought them out.
                            Thanks Jerry, I was not aware of a buy out. now the big question is did they move the manufacturing overseas ? i need to check that out

                            Rich

                            Green Bay, WI

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by aribert View Post
                              ..............................

                              J Tiers: Unbrako was bought out by Deepack (India) in '08. Guessing if there was a problem with the fastener quality since, it would be noted somewhere.
                              There seems to be an Unbrako LLC, and Unbrako . The one leads to Misumi the other leads to Deepack. Apparently Deepack is still the owner of the "actual" Unbrako.

                              From the "real" Unbrako site:

                              "Unbrako was acquired by the Deepak Fasteners Group in 2008 and has since grown multi-fold with new warehouse facilities in Birmigham (UK), Los Angeles (USA) and Brisbane (Australia). Further a $100 million has been made in the new state-of-the-art manufacturing plant in Bhopal. www.deepakfasteners.com "

                              and

                              "n 2005, an agreement was signed with SPS Technologies to manufacture & market Unbrako in the Indian subcontinent. In 2008, Deepak Fasteners acquired the brand Unbrako from SPS Technologies, along with sub-brands Durlok & Sel-lok, Ireland manufacturing unit & the Melbourne warehouse.
                              .......................
                              Acquired the brands Unbrako®, Durlok® & Sel-lok® from SPS Technologies, along with the Shannon (Ireland) manufacturing unit & the Melbourne (Australia) Warehouse. Shannon plant today also serves as Distribution and Engineering Support Centre."


                              So evidently, yes, it has all been transferred to India (not one of our best friends), and it may be that there is ZERO manufacturing in the US now. That is not clear, and there may not have been any US manufacturing even before acquisition.

                              Quality? Might still be good at the moment. What happens when there is no local US manufacturing or control at all over the product is anybody's guess. Could be poorer quality, could be a cutoff of product due to politics or transport issues, whatever.
                              Last edited by J Tiers; 05-19-2022, 10:07 AM.
                              CNC machines only go through the motions

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