Aloris wedge toolpost - any adjustment on qty of wedge?

[aribert]

I recently upgraded my lathe from a piston BXA size to a genuine Aloris CXA wedge toolpost. It works well with a couple of Aloris toolholders and some Yuasa toolholders (about 2/3 to 3/4 of handle travel at toolholder properly secured). I have a few older import toolholders and they secure nearer to the end of travel. Now a few weeks ago I bought an import boring bar holder and a 4 pack of toolholders - these are the ones where the block is longer (a feature I like). Even though sellers give their toolholders different brand names; based on the form; the P/N itself; the P/N size, font and location, all toolholders appear to be from the same manufacturer. Of the 5 recently purchased toolholders, for 4 of them I can swing the locking lever full travel and I can slip the holder up off of the post. On the remaining one, the handle resistance (as the wedge begins to do its job) just begins as the handle reaches its end travel. I am not able to slide this toolholder up off the post but I am convinced it is not properly secured.

I have had a few import tool holders that were a bit tight on either the AXA or BXA piston toolposts - where the lever had to be just right to be able to slide the tool holder onto the post. But I have not experienced the holder being too large. Then again I was not using a wedge tool post.

I presume there is no adjustment as to the qty of wedge action on an Aloris wedge tool post. Correct? While there might be some wear on the tool post (bought used), the Aloris and Yuasa toolholders are secured at 2/3 to 3/4 of handle rotation. I suspect these holders would work just fine on a piston toolpost. I started the return request w/ eBay and the seller is singing the blues since the return shipping is no subsidized. I just wanted to make sure there is not something I could be doing to improve the engagement. BTW, I have attached the images I supplied the eBay seller for the boring bar holder comparing the Aloris tool holder to the newly purchased boring bar holder.

[Toolguy]

You can glue or use double sided tape to stick a shim of the proper thickness to the front angle of the dovetail, thereby making the dovetail smaller. You don't want to put it on the wedge side, as that may shift the shim around when you lock it down. Use a feeler gage set in there first to find the thickness you want for the handle position you want.

[eKretz]

Just send them back. There's nothing you're missing. I would absolutely not monkey around with trying to shim toolholders that have dovetails that are cut too large.

[mikey553]

What size dowel pins did you use for your measurements? I have over 20 BXA toolholders from different manufacturers and none of them gives me the problem you describe. My post is Phase-II, wedge type. I can check my holders to compare with your measurements if you provide the pin size.

[aribert]

What size dowel pins did you use for your measurements? I have over 20 BXA toolholders from different manufacturers and none of them gives me the problem you describe. My post is Phase-II, wedge type. I can check my holders to compare with your measurements if you provide the pin size.

mikey553
Thanks for the offer. I left a key pc of information out of my original post - since edited - namely that I upgraded to a CXA. Pins were 0.25 inch

[aribert]

Thank you all for your prompt responses. I do intend to send them back. I just wanted to make sure there was no error (lack of adjustment) on my part. And a second intention to my original posting was to alert others that the import CXA tool holders (large block configuration) currently available might be suspect if using a wedge tool post.

I went poking around on Amazon and found Shars was listing some at a price close to what I was paying for the ones machined over size and these (per the supplied images) are shorter length, like the original Aloris tool holders and the Shars have different font size and location to the current common toolholders. If the Shar's toolholders are in fact shorter then they are somewhat less likely to be manufactured in the same facility as the ones I will be returning. I plan to order one as a test and then order more if they are OK.

[eKretz]

I have a few Shars in CA size, they lock up fine on my Aloris post.

[JRouche]

Thank you all for your prompt responses. I do intend to send them back. I just wanted to make sure there was no error (lack of adjustment) on my part. And a second intention to my original posting was to alert others that the import CXA tool holders (large block configuration) currently available might be suspect if using a wedge tool post..

Yeah, glad it will work out. I think you nailed it with the CXA size. They are not as prevalent as the BXA and AXA. So the manufactures of the CXA are less, and few. Quality control. JR

[Toolguy]

I use a lot of Shars tooling. So far, everything has been good quality, and a good value compared to similar items from other sources.

[JoeLee]

You can glue or use double sided tape to stick a shim of the proper thickness to the front angle of the dovetail, thereby making the dovetail smaller. You don't want to put it on the wedge side, as that may shift the shim around when you lock it down. Use a feeler gage set in there first to find the thickness you want for the handle position you want.

Shimming works but I wouldn't want the shim held in place with any double stick tape because the tape and glue is compressible and will eventually get attacked by oil etc. and probably get squeezed out.

JL............

[JoeLee]

I've had a few of those Aloris TP apart. There is no adjustment with the position of the screw that has three starts.
I have an older BXA with several original tool holders that cam with it. The handle stops at the same place with all of them at about the 3 o-cock position. I've collected several newer genuine Aloris tool holders and I've found that the handle locks well past the 3 o-clock position with them. Some at around 4 or 5 o-clock and had a couple that locked up at about 6 o-clock which was a PIA because the handle was into my stomach when leaning over the machine. I sent a few of them back and they were replaced. Not perfect like the originals by by todays corner cutting standards I guess it was acceptable. Putting a .003 shim behind the flat part of the tool holder would cause the handle to lock from 4 o-clock to about 2 o-clock. It doesn't take much. Between the dovetail width and the back side of the tool holder where it contacts the tool post tolerances are pretty tight if you want repeatability as far as where the handle locks.

JL..............

[Doozer]

The Dorian toolposts offer a handle that you can re-clock.
A nice option to have.
If your import holders clock too late,
like 6 o'clock or more, one thing that is easy to do
is bronze braze some material on the outside flat face
of the holder. Drop it on the surface grinder (or mill)
and remove the braze buildup, leaving .020" or so
and check for fit on the toolpost. You can grind bronze
braze just fine with a 46J wheel. Much better than
welding some unknown steel. You do not have to mess
with the dovetail angled surfaces, as was mentioned.

-Doozer

[BCRider]

Shimming works but I wouldn't want the shim held in place with any double stick tape because the tape and glue is compressible and will eventually get attacked by oil etc. and probably get squeezed out.

JL............

Totally agree. Plus the tape would be "squishy" for feel on the lever and would permit some movement. I'm thinking that one of the industrial adhesives would be a better option for a shim. And since there would not be the proper gap for the adhesive to work properly I think roughing up both sides with coarse scratch marks would at least give a "mat" of glue threads to aid with a good hold.

But in this case I think aribert is right to request a return. It's not rocket surgery to make the dovetails fit correctly and match the other stuff. Those same companies that I've bought the AXA holders from managed it with that size. I've gotten four sets of four now and they all lock up with the lever over maybe 1/5 of the arc of travel.

[JoeLee]

The Dorian toolposts offer a handle that you can re-clock.
A nice option to have.
If your import holders clock too late,
like 6 o'clock or more, one thing that is easy to do
is bronze braze some material on the outside flat face
of the holder. Drop it on the surface grinder (or mill)
and remove the braze buildup, leaving .020" or so
and check for fit on the toolpost. You can grind bronze
braze just fine with a 46J wheel. Much better than
welding some unknown steel. You do not have to mess
with the dovetail angled surfaces, as was mentioned.

-Doozer

Having a handle that you can re-clock is a nice option. Anywhere between 2 & 4 o-clock is OK, at least for me.

Somewhere I saw some tool holders that had four raised pads on the flat back side of the tool holder. Milling some elongated slots and silver soldering some pads to it would be a good option.
Then just grind the pads to get the handle to clock where you want. Preferably the same position for all your tool holders. The last thing you want to mess with is the DT part.

JL.............

[Doozer]

The silver solder costs more than the $12 that you paid for the import toolholder.
Seriously.

-D