You guys are going to like this vid, classic engine start ups...

[A.K. Boomer]

I am outside in the real world running engines.
You are dreaming of danger from your chair posting on the internet.
Who is in a fetal tuck exactly?

-D

Oh wow so now you have more engine experience than I do? your not only in a fetal tuck --- your fuquing dreaming...

Stop freaking out about trying to figure out how a guy got his fingers severed --- it will be ok - there's people you can talk too to make you feel better...

[Doozer]

Lol nah Dooze was just putting the past scene of the crime together on how the old man lost two of his --- get out of your fetal tuck, everythings going to be ok...

I am outside in the real world running engines.
You are dreaming of danger from your chair posting on the internet.
Who is in a fetal tuck exactly?

-D

[A.K. Boomer]

That's according to FM. I have no idea how they arrived at that number.

I just looked at specs real quick and looks like it's identical stroke for upper and lower pistons/crank throws, Kinda makes sense for not upsetting the balance but that only leaves one explanation, the 12 degree's advancement favors the lower cranks optimum rod angle/piston speed during burn rate, still 75% would be a substantial boost from just that,

but really all I can come up with - for now anyways...

[A.K. Boomer]

So the danger of an extremely unlikely scenario to remove ones fingers is what comes immediately to the forefront of your mind?
You do realize this engine is like 15 feet tall ??? I have personally had my hands on a running F-M engine like this, and staying
away from the spinning flywheel spokes was in the front of my mind. This particular engine had zoomie style headers and there
was not even a chance of getting near the piston ports. You may either be afraid of everything or afraid of the wrong things.

-D

Lol nah Dooze was just putting the past scene of the crime together on how the old man lost two of his --- get out of your fetal tuck, everythings going to be ok...

[Doozer]

Strange engine, you could see with ports that low if there was a way to have fingers in there it would not take any rotational effort at all to sever them that's a very high leverage ratio for crank rotational degree's compared to piston movement...

So the danger of an extremely unlikely scenario to remove ones fingers is what comes immediately to the forefront of your mind?
You do realize this engine is like 15 feet tall ??? I have personally had my hands on a running F-M engine like this, and staying
away from the spinning flywheel spokes was in the front of my mind. This particular engine had zoomie style headers and there
was not even a chance of getting near the piston ports. You may either be afraid of everything or afraid of the wrong things.

-D

[CarlByrns]

That's according to FM. I have no idea how they arrived at that number.

[A.K. Boomer]

The lower crankshaft leads the upper by 12 degrees for exhaust scavenging, it also produces about 75% of the total output.

Unusual statement, since both pistons appear to be the same size and are under identical pressures, so is the lower crank stroked quite a bit more?

[CarlByrns]

They sound different, too. A constant drumming with very little difference between idle and full power. The picture doesn't show it, but there's a blower for scavenging air. The upper pistons open the intake ports, the lowers open exhaust. The lower crankshaft leads the upper by 12 degrees for exhaust scavenging, it also produces about 75% of the total output.

[A.K. Boomer]

Strange engine, you could see with ports that low if there was a way to have fingers in there it would not take any rotational effort at all to sever them that's a very high leverage ratio for crank rotational degree's compared to piston movement...

[CarlByrns]

When I first moved out west I worked for an old guy who had a couple fingers missing - turns out he was working on a half disassembled diesel engine with a co-worker when said worker turned the engine over some with a wrench - off went the fingers that were for some reason in a cylinder port - musta been a Detroit...

Might have been a Fairbanks-Morse opposed piston. They have huge ports. A popular engine for back up generators and water pumps, also used in US WWII submarines (where they worked very well) and FM built locomotives with them (which didn't work out so well). Modern US submarines still use them for emergency power.

[A.K. Boomer]

When I first moved out west I worked for an old guy who had a couple fingers missing - turns out he was working on a half disassembled diesel engine with a co-worker when said worker turned the engine over some with a wrench - off went the fingers that were for some reason in a cylinder port - musta been a Detroit...

I like working on stuff alone...

Then again, an older bro was working on one of his old bossmans antique buicks? had the oil pan off and was removing the distributor drive or distributor or some damn thing, car was on ramps, anyways as he raised the distributor out of the block some (from under the car) it connected with a bunch of old frayed cloth wires, turned out they went to the starter solenoid and kicked in the starter - one of the crank throws or counterbalancers pinned his hand between the crank and the engine block,,,,,,,,,,,, lucky for the bro the battery was almost dead but still starter pinon up against massive crank ring gear = crazy leverage, he was alone - yelling but no help, he had an extra long extension on the ground and he could see one of the battery cables overhanging the battery and just started poking at it from underneath and it finally disconnected,,,

His hand grew twice the size for about a week - he did not beak any bones --- if it was a fully charged battery he would not have a hand today,,, and if it was fully charged and the car was in gear he most likely would have been killed... crazy times...

[Willy]

In defense of the Deutz V12 it was never designed nor tailored for truck use where clutch engagement torque is a critical aspect of operation when trying to "lift" a load from a dead stop.
This goes back into the mid to early 70's when an old friend needed a replacement engine for his ailing KW logging truck. He got the V12 Deutz for free, had the regional Deutz distributor go over the engine and source a SAE bellhousing adapter to mate his 13 speed Eaton transmission and he was back in business and for the most part happy.
However the torque output was underwhelming, although it got the job done.

The DD 12V71NA was rated at about 450HP with 1200 lb.ft. of torque, the DD12V71T had 525HP and 1450 lb. ft., both at 1600 rpm.
Meanwhile the Deutz had a decent 325HP but could only muster about 825-850 lb. ft. at 1400rpm.

Funny you mentioned the 6 cyl. Maxidyne. I always called it the little engine that could.

Mid 70's had me hauling wood chips to a pulp mill, about a 200 mile round trip with a few fair sized hills thrown in the mix.
We had three tandem axle Mack tractors and as often as not I got the "little six". First time I saw the truck I said, you've got to be kidding. A six that didn't look much bigger than a 300 cu. in. Ford 6 mated to a five spd.in a tandem axle tractor hauling a 45 ft. trailer load of chips!?

Having had the opportunity to having driven almost identical trucks in the past where the only difference being that one was a single axle and the other a tandem, I can verify without a doubt that that extra set of screws soaks up a lot of power, so I had my doubts.
After the first trip I was totally impressed! Could have used a 10 spd. to gain some speed on the hills, but holy cow what an amazing engine! Sounded and felt like a D8 pushing out a huge stump!

[CarlByrns]

Regarding the Deutz air cooled engine, I have actually driven a 19L V-12 Deutz powered logging truck back in the day. Good engine and it sounds cool, as well as solving a lot of logistical installation issues during the conversion that a friend did to his KW at the time. However I may be a bit jaded in my assessment of it's power and torque when I say that I remember it as being a dog compared to the then current offerings from Cat, Cummins, and Detroit Diesel. The later at the time offered a 12V71 2 cycle that would blow the Deutz out of the water, while the Cummins 855 Cu. In. engines too had a much greater output while having much more torque down low than either the DD 12V71 or the Deutz.
This while sporting engines that were 5L. smaller than the Deutz.
Mind you I still have great respect for the KHD engines, they have a long history of reliability in a very diverse set of operational theaters.

There must have been something wrong with the Deutz. Speaking as a fan of the screaming DD 71 series, I can tell you no one ever accused them of generating the kind of torque a four-cycle diesel does 🙂.

You'll appreciate this- I did a check ride with a Mack R600 with the Maxidyne 6 cylinder and a 5 speed, single speed axle. Shifted like a pickup truck. The torque was phenomenal- in town you could leave it in 3rd right up to a traffic light, get the green and hammer down- the whole frame would twist and off you'd go. First couple of intersections, the checkout guy reached over and held the stick in 3rd so I couldn't drop a gear.

[SVS]

Speaking of Deutz re-powers. My Dad swapped a 250 hp naturally aspirated V 10 Deutz into this Versatile in place of a 145 hp V 8 Cummins in about 83’ Took about 20 years for the extra power to shell out the transmission.

Picture is around 88’ when my 18 year old knees still thought saving time jumping out of tractors was smart.

[Willy]

The trailer that the RR Griffon is situated on is clearly not going anywhere. The trailer's back axle is almost clear of the pavement due to the outrigger legs having been deployed, it's pretty much immovable seeing as how it's wedged between the legs and the wheel chocks. I'm sure these guys have done this before and realize the amount of thrust the clipped prop blades are capable of. Now put a set of full sized set of props on her and it would be a different story I'm sure.

Yeah the clip of the Cat 3406B is where buddy almost got stuck to the intake manifold. The flange was left open as well as the turbo's charge air outlet. Normally they would be plumbed together via the charge air intercooler whose outlet would bolt onto the intake flange that buddy almost got stuck to. LOL
That video clip must have been an old one as the caption stated that this was the new 3604B engine, that would have been about 1983, or 40 years ago!
Horsepower figures are down of course too since Caterpillar was up to about 575 HP with that engines C15/16 variant when they got out of the on-highway truck engine business around 2009.

Regarding the Deutz air cooled engine, I have actually driven a 19L V-12 Deutz powered logging truck back in the day. Good engine and it sounds cool, as well as solving a lot of logistical installation issues during the conversion that a friend did to his KW at the time. However I may be a bit jaded in my assessment of it's power and torque when I say that I remember it as being a dog compared to the then current offerings from Cat, Cummins, and Detroit Diesel. The later at the time offered a 12V71 2 cycle that would blow the Deutz out of the water, while the Cummins 855 Cu. In. engines too had a much greater output while having much more torque down low than either the DD 12V71 or the Deutz.
This while sporting engines that were 5L. smaller than the Deutz.
Mind you I still have great respect for the KHD engines, they have a long history of reliability in a very diverse set of operational theaters.