Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Plans full auto co2 bb "usi" submachinegun

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Plans full auto co2 bb "usi" submachinegun

    Anyone interested in plans for a full auto bb submachine gun with the following specifications? (The prototype isn't quite complete yet so the specs aren't locked in)

    30 round mag (finished) ,230 round drum mag (in progress)
    approx 3-6 round/second
    approx 400fps velocity
    uses standard bbgun 12g co2 cartridges
    barrel - approx 12" actual (beyond the firing chamber) made of ultra low coefficient of friction materials.
    very simple and robust design easily machinable with mini mill and lathe. Has about half a dozen moving parts. Most of it can be machined from acetal (plastic) or other materials of moderate mechanical properties.

    Drawings include exploded view assembly drawings with parts lists, detail drawings, and graphic illustrations. And the details can be in either U.S. or metric units. No plans for foreign languages. I'm not soliciting this as I didn't really plan to release these drawings and designs at all.

    Almost got the design complete and have a prototype and was wondering if anyone is interested or has done something similar. I'm a bb gun nut by the way. I was just planning to auction these on e-bay as hand crafted custom machined low volume production (made by myself working like a dog) - sold-to-the-highest-bidder-thing.

    Heres a brief glimpse. I've cruelly marked out details so hopefully my prospective patents won't be infringed.

    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...ry/usi_mk1.jpg
    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...ry/bm30mag.jpg

    If this works out, I plan to move on to making full auto bb gun carbines using the new bigger co2 cans. Hehehe!
    “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

    Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

  • #2
    Do you suppose it'd disable a rabbit in a man's garden at a range of ..., say 30-40 yds?

    What sort of velocity does a regular BB gun shoot anyway? That 400fps sounds kind of slow.

    I can disable 'em with a pump-up Crosman. (when I hit 'em that is) Enough to move up and finish them off. Tho I'm usually shooting pellets.
    But that full automatic might tip the scales more in my favor for the initial hit.
    Lynn (Huntsville, AL)

    Comment


    • #3
      That's pretty darn cool. I remember always trying that one contest at the carnival where you had to shoot out a little star on the target with a full auto bb gun. I think you got 100 rounds to do it. I guess the gun was run off an air compressor. The trick was to shoot around the star. Everyone assumed you had to completely obliterate the star from the middle out and that never worked. Do any of you remember that game, or was it something unique to the Crab Festival in Lacombe, LA?

      Stuart
      Stuart de Haro

      Comment


      • #4
        Looks good to me. Would make a fun project.

        rock-
        Civil engineers build targets, Mechanical engineers build weapons.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by hornluv
          That's pretty darn cool. I remember always trying that one contest at the carnival where you had to shoot out a little star on the target with a full auto bb gun. I think you got 100 rounds to do it. I guess the gun was run off an air compressor. The trick was to shoot around the star. Everyone assumed you had to completely obliterate the star from the middle out and that never worked. Do any of you remember that game, or was it something unique to the Crab Festival in Lacombe, LA?

          Stuart
          Actually, that was my inspiration. Except as I recall, the carnival in my area had tommy guns running off an air compressor but they only had like 10 or 20 shot magazines and the goal was to shoot off a rubber duck (weighted with lead shot of course) and I suspect the inner barrel was bent or out of line and the sights adjusted so your first shots hit about 4' from the target.

          The best small cartridge co2 bbguns have only a little over 400fps velocity, the lowest I've seen (but ironically the funnest to shoot) is the Walther Crosman PPK at about 250fps which half its charge goes to power the realistic kickback of the steel slide (which weighs more than my whole gun). There are custom over $200 single pump, single shot bb guns that go over 1000 fps but my goal is to shred paper targets (or aluminum soda cans, etc) with blistering rate of fire. I imagine those 1000fps bb guns take an armstrong approach to pump up. The standard 10pump type bb guns reach about 600fps at 10 pumps I think but don't recall exactly.

          Anyway, my goal is massive rate of fire (buy bbs by the pound) not massive fps. With the larger co2 cans coupled with longer barrel lengths in my upcomming carbines (muzzle velocity is a function of barrel length and psi in an air gun for the most part) we may see an order of magnitude increase in muzzle velocity with similarly high rate of fire.
          “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

          Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

          Comment


          • #6
            hornluv,
            We played the same game at our state fair in Hutchinson, Ks. 36-37yrs. ago. The guns in the booths there were modeled after Thompson submachineguns. I think they were using #7 or #7-1/2 soft lead shot in them - if it'd been steel shot, there'd have been shot bouncing back at all the rubes trying to impress their girlfriends. I've often wondered where all those neat old subgun airguns wound up; it'd be fun to take one apart and get a good look at the mechanism.
            Regards,
            Dennis

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by lynnl
              Do you suppose it'd disable a rabbit in a man's garden at a range of ..., say 30-40 yds?

              What sort of velocity does a regular BB gun shoot anyway? That 400fps sounds kind of slow.

              I can disable 'em with a pump-up Crosman. (when I hit 'em that is) Enough to move up and finish them off. Tho I'm usually shooting pellets.
              But that full automatic might tip the scales more in my favor for the initial hit.
              Thats odd, the rabbits around my place prefer to eat the grass but I didnt plant any carrots or lettuce this spring. I wouldn't use any bb gun on rabbits, use a 22 caliber firearm, shotgun, or a bow with the wieghted rabbit clobbering head that makes the arrow stick in the ground and stand straight up when you miss- which you will probably do alot of.
              “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

              Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by flatlander
                hornluv,
                We played the same game at our state fair in Hutchinson, Ks. 36-37yrs. ago. The guns in the booths there were modeled after Thompson submachineguns. I think they were using #7 or #7-1/2 soft lead shot in them - if it'd been steel shot, there'd have been shot bouncing back at all the rubes trying to impress their girlfriends. I've often wondered where all those neat old subgun airguns wound up; it'd be fun to take one apart and get a good look at the mechanism.
                They're probably illegal now (for carnival or residential areas) which is why I plan to sell them on e-bay. The mechanism can be quite simple if you understand the physics. Its not alot tho, only about 6 pages of calculations describe most of what I expect to happen. The 400fps is based on 100psi air compressor which I plan to do initial tests with. Don't know how many psi the cartridges have but I suspect it may start out producing like 600fps muzzle velocity and drop as the cartridge discharges.
                “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

                Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Have you seen this:
                  http://makarov.com/drozd/index.html
                  Largest resource on the web for Taig lathes and milling machines, www.cartertools.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I will stick to the easy ones....
                    http://www.burntlatke.com/bb.html

                    Both of yours have a small, limited BB supply. This design,is only limited by your own design,and weight restrictions.
                    As for air supply,a 5# co2 fire extinguisher regulated is fine.

                    I have owned the Lark, Drozd, and others from various mfgrs.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Nick Carter

                      Nice but I bet that has about 10x more parts than mine. Also, my design is fully mechanical. Don't see any price on it. Even hand crafting, mine should be around $200 each (to pay me minimum wage). Hopefully selling in small quantities on e-bay the price for mine may go alot higher. Also, you don't know who designed and makes that Russian gun. Doesn't mean its not good or bad, just that you know mine was designed by an engineer with a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Engineering (from a top 10 engineering university - top 10 in the world.) I was hoping I was the only one working on something like this. Oh well. I'm still going to finish mine (about 2 weeks) and at least try selling one on ebay. If the gun works well but selling it doesn't work, I may make the plans available for a small charge.
                      “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

                      Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well, now that you have crossed the line....
                        THERE IS NO SELLING OF PERSONAL STUFF HERE!

                        I wouldn't have said a thing about it, But without even seeing the other gun you think yours is better.Thats not what we are about here.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Haha, I'm not selling anything here. You guys are too cheap. If it don't sell at all, then I may give the plans "as is" which is what I used to actually build it. The only charge would be if you want me to clean up the drafting so it looks pretty enough to satisfy a moderately leanient drafting instructer (which I was once at ITT- not my alumni just where I worked as a drafting & design instructor while working on a Masters degree I never finished).

                          I do have a design remarkably similar to that Russian one, even with similar placement of mechanisms and with an electric motor too. But it was for a thompson "tommy" looking carbine size machine gun (although actually it looks sort of like a cross between a tommy gun and an m4 carbine). I want to try out the simple, small, purely mechanical, submachine gun first, only problem is my mini-mill & lathe may not be up to making the only 3 tolerance (and friction) critical parts in this design. In which case I will probably just go with the tommy gun.

                          If I could mass produce the "usi" submachine gun (acctually was gonna call it the "Box Mag" first for obvious reasons -but I put a little 2hand grip and milled a few cuts and it now looks remarkably like an "uzi") I may theoretically be able to sell it for around $50 depending on the difficulty of making those few critical parts. This is theoretical, as I don't plan to mass produce anything unless I can get some high bid wars going on e-bay.

                          I may mention it here if one sells for some preposterously high amount just to gloat tho.
                          “It was not til Leibniz and Newton, by the discovery of the differential calculus, had dispelled the ancient darkness which enveloped the conception of the infinite, and had clearly established the conception of the continuous and continuous change, that a full and productive application of the newly found mechanical conceptions made any progressâ€‌

                          Hermann von Helmholtz (1821-1894)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I'd be interested.
                            KMFDM
                            Better Than The Best
                            Megalomaniacal
                            And Harder Than The Rest

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Yours looks better than the ones my friends and I bought back in the mid 70's I think. They were pretty cheesy and not well constructed but they were cheap. I can't remember how much they were but we bought a lot of them.
                              We soon ditched the CO2 cartridge for a 120 psi air compressor. You'd go through 500 BBs in the blink of an eye but it sure was fun while it lasted.
                              TS

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X