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  • 5c collet chuck Yeah or Neah

    I think I asked before but no one was interested then. I hope boredom has overcome some so they may offer some help this time. I bought a lever operated 5c collet chuck from Grizzly for my G4003 lathe.
    http://www.grizzly.com/products/G4003

    That is the link for the pic and also specs.

    Anyway I thought the lever closer would be neat. After setting it up and running it for a few days I took it off and on the bench it sits. It shakes so bad it rattles the lathe even at speeds under 200 rpm's.

    My question is this normal for this type of chuck or is it junk?

    It seems to me the design is the trouble as it has so many joints and the knuckle that is part of the release lever spins with the spindle. There is no way it could be balanced that I can tell so I feel it is what it is. Wanted to have some real wisdom so I can call Grizzly and see what they will do. Also are there other types of collet chucks I can get? I know little to nothing about collet chucks so I ask for help.
    Life Is Grand

  • #2
    Shouldn't you have put up this link?
    http://www.grizzly.com/products/h5948
    Just a wild guess that it's the same
    Last edited by torker; 01-06-2007, 01:53 AM.
    I have tools I don't even know I own...

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    • #3
      "It shakes so bad it rattles the lathe even at speeds under 200 rpm's."
      Sounds like something is loose in there no expert but these things have been used on screw nachines for a long time for production work. I have never used the lever type only the handle /drawbar type there should be an adpter from 5-c to 5mT or whatever it is. You did not forget to put it in did you ? check your set up somthing is wrong either with the part itself or the install. I would think a 5c lever should work like a dream. The other thought is can you move the tailstock end if the support collar on the back end does not fit properly this could be your problem . Is this made for your lathe or is it adapable to several models?
      Tin
      Last edited by Tin Falcon; 01-06-2007, 01:58 AM.
      Ad maiorem dei gloriam - Ad vitam paramus

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      • #4
        cybor462,
        I have a Royal lever collet closer that I purchased new last year. One of the set up operations when installing it was to center the hub on the end of the spindle with a dial indicator. If it is not centered the closer will rattle like crazy. Even with it centered it will still make some noise at high rpms. I tend to run my lathe at or close to max rpm (1800) most of the time, so the noise was there much of the time. I have since changed the lever closer to a pneumatic one and no more noise. I also have an import lever collet closer on my smaller lathe. It makes less noise than the Royal lever closer.

        I would check the run out on the hub before I call Grizzly.
        Mark Hockett

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        • #5
          I have the same lathe and closer, No wobble at all . Did you follow the instructions (goofy as they are) ? The main problem I have had is the two set screws that lock the adapter on tail end of spindle must be tight, or else the whole works unscrews and binds everything up. Be sure to clean out the threads in the end of spindle before mounting adapter, a chip in there will cock adapter and cause problems. It always runs smooth/true even wide open. I will convert it to a wheel style tho, because it takes so long dinking with the lever mount (change gear cover nut swap) and getting the screws adjusted that fit in the engage bearing). It is tricky getting it set up and getting the proper amount of grab on the collets with out being so far out that the locking pin comes out of the collar/rear spindle adapter. Sometimes have to run collet threads deeper or shallower into collet closer tube and readjust at rear adjuster.

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          • #6
            Torker ,,well I put the lathe pic up but was unable to find the collet chuck that I have on their web page. It is somewhat like the one you posted but it is slightly different. My closer is a G4026 looks like the linkage is different. If you know how to get to it please post the link.

            Tin,, nice to hear from you,, I am not sure what you mean "tailstock end" this is mounted in the spindle Headstock, maybe I am lost though. Yes it is made for this lathe.

            Bgun,, your the man! You better run and hide as I now have someone with my exact machine I can ask questions of. To answer your question I did follow their directions with setup and wow yes you are so right about getting it adjusted to close properly. It seems I spend forever getting it right but then it closes fine all the time until you change out the work material and then you tinker all over again.
            I made sure the setscrews were tight never had a problem there. Just seems the bearing and the engagement hub wobble like mad. I do not see any way of truing it.
            You mention wheel type, which model or make would I need for this lathe?
            Does Grizzly have one. I asked them when I got this if this is all they offer and they did not seem to know.
            Grizzly tech's are real pleasent but for some reason do not seem to really know the products they sell.
            I will tell you one thing I love this lathe, it beats the Smithy I had hands down. This one is like a modern automobile with its dependability and the Smithy was like a model A Ford always breaking down. Yes they still both are cars but I would take a modern day car for dependability anyday.
            I hope I did not offend any model A owners. or Smithy owners for that matter!
            I would really like to know about this wheel type you mention.


            Jim
            Life Is Grand

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            • #7
              Torker I am sorry. I found my closer but they use the same pic as the one you posted. The pic is wrong. If you look in Grizzly's new 2007 catalog page 591 you will see my closer. My bearing hub is different and so is the linkage.
              Life Is Grand

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              • #8
                The handwheel drawbar uses a fixed handwheel at the outboard end of the headstock to draw the collet in. These are simpler and less expensive than the lever type. They are much better suited to the home shop for one or two off applications. The lever type can be a headache to install, set up and remove when not needed. It is best suited for large runs of similar sized parts is being made.

                This is a recent auction for a handwheel closer;
                http://cgi.ebay.com/HARDINGE-Lathe-c...em120067310916
                Jim H.

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                • #9
                  I bought a lever closer with my new Grizzly 14" lathe...never could get it to work and neither could Grizzly. They gave me my money back and I built my own hand wheel type. It works fine .
                  John R

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                  • #10
                    Cybor462, this may have been mentioned but do you have an adapter on the rear of the spindle? Is it the right one for the machine? On Royal's closers, they spec a close fit (< 0.0005" ??) for this part to the spindle rear bore. Any adapter/bushing required for your machine from the closer tube OD to your spindle ID?

                    After reading thru the posts here about inconsistent closer behavior, I can only offer one comment to others thinking about buying a closer ... BUY AMERICAN.

                    You can pick up a Royal on ebay, perhaps even new, for less than the price of the Grizzly import. Operation is smooth, dependable and sweet ! This is why the closer came to be in the first place. At most, a minor adjustment at the tail end involves a one finger press and rotate to the next or previous index slot for the grip desired. Other than that, you get smooth quiet operation up to around 4,000 RPM or so.

                    Only problem is, hurry fast 'cause Royal dropped out of the manual closer market this year.

                    <edited to convert from an unintended hijack to try and help OP >
                    Last edited by nheng; 01-06-2007, 11:32 AM.

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                    • #11
                      They dont all rattle, my friends hardinge super precision is good through all rpms but it is a "chucker lathe" to begin with so the chucker arm is not mounted on there as an afterthought, He also has an MSC that he mounts a chucker arm on and its no where near as stable and balanced but its not a rattle box either --- do what Mark stated, indicate it, check out a few other things like straightness and uniform wall thickness for balance -- there is a simple reason or reasons why this is happening and it should not be to hard to track down...

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                      • #12
                        nheng,, Yes it has an adapter that threads on the rear of the spindle tube. It turns in or out to adjust. The problem I see is that the entire tail end of the closer/lever end is out of round. It shakes rattles and rolls. Not much I can do to fix it nor do I have any want to after buying it new for 300.00 I will call Grizzly and see what they say. I may have just got a bad one. It uses cast pieces that are not equal in dia. and really wobble. The bearing hub also wobbles so it is a lose situation. I just did not know how these were supposed to be although I knew it should not have been that bad. I always ask before sending something back in case I may have missed something.

                        Thanks for all your help. I did go to Royals web site and from what I read there are certain specs that have to be met with their closers. Not sure if buying one from Ebay would be the way to go. Royal has a form to fill out to order it giving many dimensions of your machine. Not sure if you could get that info on the closer from an ebay auction.
                        Life Is Grand

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                        • #13
                          I bought this one as it came with a di-4" chuck fitting it is a beauty not ried it yet as I got it for xmas Alistair



                          http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/acatalog/i...ml&CatalogBody
                          Please excuse my typing as I have a form of parkinsons disease

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                          • #14
                            There are 2 screws on the handlever with jam nuts for attachment to the bearing. I have found that if these screws get loose, the handlever will vibrate, also vibrates if any part of the linkage gets too loose. Alignment is very critical to the proper performance of the closer.
                            Harry

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                            • #15
                              I am sitting here holding the closer...........The most obvious thing I can think of is, your draw tube is bent. Lightly chuck it up in the lathe and steady and see if it spins true. All the rotating parts are round, so its hard to see how one could be off. The adapter that screws into tail end of spindle should not show more than a little runout when screwed in and locked with 2 setcrews from end. Grab drawtube and bearing assy while it is out of lathe and spin Bearing and taper (engagement ramp), the bearing and taper should spin true with no wobble. Next check the Large Round knurled pin lock/cam lever unit, spin it on the threads a short distance (and screw up your collet adjustment ) It also should not wobble. The drawtube is pretty thin, I almost bet its bent.....................A handwheel could be made to convert the existing tube to
                              wheel style, and add a thrust bearing. Just replace the big knurled cam assy with a wheel and thrust bearing. If that works, than chop off the extra 4 inch piece of drawtube that the lever closer slid on.
                              Last edited by Bguns; 01-06-2007, 06:41 PM.

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