Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

OT Global warming a runaway train ?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • OT Global warming a runaway train ?

    Says a new report from the international climate change body. What do you suppose the agenda is behind this proclamation? Could it be that we're about to be taxed to death no matter where we live? Or perhaps, could it be an effort to control every aspect of our lives that influences emissions ... including the $hitter

  • #2
    Global warming is real. The only thing in question is who or what to blame. It really doesn't matter all that much. No matter if it is 100% the fault of humans, or is purely natural, nothing we do now will stop it or even slow it significantly.

    It is indeed a runaway train. Imagine a train 1 million cars long that has accelerated for over 200 years. If we are the cause then whatever we do won't be equivalent to putting on the brakes, but only pulling back the throttle a bit.

    If it is largely natural or some combination of the two (most likely) then what we do has even less effect. The sensible thing to do starting now is plan on how to deal with the effects as best we can.
    Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

    Comment


    • #3
      Since when have politicians or environmentalists been sensible, or even attempted to appear so? No, they will use this and any other emotional/scary issue they can find to push their agenda and increase their power. Truth and reality are only minor annoyances to either of those crowds...
      Russ
      Master Floor Sweeper

      Comment


      • #4
        Haven't we had this before?

        Seems Greenland 's south coast was farmable and actually colonized..... Then it got cold again.

        Later, the "little ice age" was mighty cold in europe..... but it is warmer now.

        Now we have stuff to blame it on, and people willing to do it, and willing to ask us not to breathe until tomorrow, in order to stop what almost surely is largely a cycle we have little control over, and may not have started.

        The question is whether the cycle has a tipping point back again, and can that point be predicted.

        Or is it an open ended warm-up that cannot be stopped and the place will be uninhabitable south of Hudson's bay?

        And, of course, what will we (but not the less developed countries, of course) be asked to do about it?

        How long do we have to refrain from breathing to make the powers that would be king, happy?

        Will it result in taxing and tight control over your every activity? In a word, YES.
        Last edited by J Tiers; 02-01-2007, 11:09 PM.
        2730

        Keep eye on ball.
        Hashim Khan


        It's just a box of rain, I don't know who put it there.

        Comment


        • #5
          Global warming propaganda is a runaway train.

          Comment


          • #6
            Global warming won't worry about it until ...

            Northern Canada is once again tropical, and then only after I've purchased some prime beach front property up near Dawson City.

            Comment


            • #7
              Personally, I think everyone's looking in the wrong direction.

              Illustrated as a percentage, CO2 concentration has risen about 31% since 1750. That's a startling number, but taken in percentage of total atmospheric volume, it actually only rose from around 0.028% to about 0.038% or about one-one-hundredth of one percent.

              On the other hand, the Sun's output of radiation has been increasing at five one-hundredths of one percent every ten years, for the last thirty years alone.

              And at the same time, the earth's magnetic field, which shields us from that radiation, has dropped a full ten percent since 1845- coincidentally, about the start of our so-called Industrial Revolution that pumped up the CO2 concentration a whopping two-one-hundredths of one percent in that time.

              Now, I may be wrong, and effect does not necessarily equal cause here, but I rather suspect that "greenhouse" gasses are a red herring, and that all the money and worry and labor spent on reducing CO2 emissions will be wasted, while the true cause- or at least the far more significant cause- is ignored. (Not that we could do anything about it anyway.)

              Doc.
              Doc's Machine. (Probably not what you expect.)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Evan
                Global warming is real. The only thing in question is who or what to blame. It really doesn't matter all that much. No matter if it is 100% the fault of humans, or is purely natural, nothing we do now will stop it or even slow it significantly.

                It is indeed a runaway train. Imagine a train 1 million cars long that has accelerated for over 200 years. If we are the cause then whatever we do won't be equivalent to putting on the brakes, but only pulling back the throttle a bit.

                If it is largely natural or some combination of the two (most likely) then what we do has even less effect. [b]The sensible thing to do starting now is plan on how to deal with the effects as best we can.[b]
                I could not agree more.

                Astronomers have noticed that “all” the planets in the solar system are also heating up. Ah! It must the exhaust from the two Mars rovers. But if the entire solar system is heating up is not reasonable to assume that whatever affect is causing this might also be effecting Earth? So rather the running around like a bunch of chickens with their feet cut off worrying about global warming, its time we should be looking for the best way to prepare for it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Yes, the ole planet is getting warmer and has been doing so for about 10,000 years. If we humans are adding to the process, I guess it's time to plant more trees; you know, the kind that transform carbon dioxide into oxygen.

                  Nice comments and statistics Doc.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    When they can discover why Mars is warming up they will know why Earth is warming up. The answer rises each day, sets each evening. The real problem is there is no money in things being normal. Cash starts to change hands in large numbers when the public is frightened and that's what we're seeing. The world is really warming up but we're not to blame. It's done it before and it will do it again.

                    Instead of swapping carbon futures with the Kyoto treaty we should be planning for mass migrations, evolving ways to help the inter-tidal zones to cope, rip out sea walls that cause even more erosion, and start prepping barren lands to become the farmlands of the future.

                    By the way - you really don't understand global warming in the macro sense until you contemplate seriously the Cosquer cave in France (Google, http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/cosquer/). And imagine what the world would be like today if they had the ability to freak out the population with global warming horror stories and to act positively to arrest the change. Safe to say there would still be a mile thick sheet of ice in Canada and Europe.

                    And to see the more hysteria at work, read this nonsense from Hawaii: http://starbulletin.com/2007/01/29/news/story01.html

                    The global sea level has risen 8" in the last century just has it has since almost forever. This damage is erosion, not global warming. Hawaii has come off some severe storms that brought uncommon but not unique flooding and storm waves. Given a bit of time the shoreline will go out again as it has in the past. But one must remember Hawaii and her island chain are wasting as do all islands. The Northwest Islands of Hawaii are very old and very small. Some day they will all go under the sea from natural causes. Hawaii is sinking at almost the same rate as the ocean levels are rising - this is the natural consequence of putting a big lump of lava on the earth's crust - the crust is being depressed from the weight. The Olympic mountains are growing in height as a result of being relieved of the ice sheets from the last ice age. Hawaii is also subject to mass wasting as when Ko`olau crater on O`ahu sluffed off into the sea and settled on the bottom 120 miles away. Same with most of Molokai, and is the apparent fate of the area of the big island between Pohala on the west, and Kilauea crater on the east. That whole slope is sliding out to sea. The result is called 'the Big Crack', and it is truly big and makes for interesting hiking. You can see in lava flows from 1875 the distance the earth has opened up. The pieces fit like a perfect puzzle. The resulting tsunami will be spectacular. It's a dynamic world.

                    Tuvalu is going under the waves, as it happens, and it's also not global warming at work. They have been pumping fresh water out of the island's interior for years and replacing it with nothing, so the island is subsiding, and the sea is moving in. Formerly fresh water ponds are now brackish. This will continue until the last pump is turned off. That does not stop the government of Tuvalu from trying to sue every nation on earth for causing global warming and rising seas. It's all about money. Their last cash cow, the .tv top level domain name was sold off, so now all they have to export is their stupidity.

                    But don't get me started or I'll get long winded

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Seems Greenland 's south coast was farmable and actually colonized..... Then it got cold again.

                      Later, the "little ice age" was mighty cold in europe..... but it is warmer now.
                      Those were minor, momentary and recent fluctuations. What we have now are the warmest times since the beginning of the last ice age, the last gasp of the dinosaurs and perhaps much, much longer. It is certain that this is the warmest period of the current interglacial. The Vostok ice cores from Antarctica go back half a million years and conclusively show that greenhouse gas levels now are the highest they have been in 1/2 million years. Average world temps are about 1 degree C below the warmest it is thought to have ever been and perhaps the warmest in the last million years. If we exceed that range, and it seems likely, we may be entering a realm where the normal checks and balances no longer operate.

                      Global warming is a reality. The indicators are impossible to refute. A cold spell here and there isn't evidence of anything. One of the major impacts of the warming trend isn't higher maximums, it is higher minimums. It doesn't get as cold at night.

                      Of course people will sieze on this to promote whatever their agenda mandates, if possible. That doesn't make it nonexistent or diminish the impact, not one bit. The fact that groups of people will use this to further their own ends does not provide any justification to downplay it or ignore it. It is happening and will affect us all. It already is.
                      Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The US is making all of the laws to controll the immisions here in the US and making it harder for industry to do business her.

                        So for that reason some industrys( along with other reasons) are moving to foregin countrys where the controlls are more lax. If we are strangling our industry to cut down on the immissions, are the other countrys strangling their industrys to help on cutting down the immissions. It seems that the air over one country will eventually drift over to us. DA DA.
                        Don\'t ask me to do a dam thing, I\'m retired.
                        http://home.earthlink.net/~kcprecision/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/m...9/ixworld.html
                          I just need one more tool,just one!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            BTW, one likely near-term effect of warming may be much colder average weather in northern Europe and the UK. The Gulf Stream circulates up to near Iceland and back down past the coast of Europe, delivering heat that prevents the climate from being like it is here even though the latitudes are similar.

                            This circulation is called the Atlantic Conveyor and it is already showing unmistakable signs of slowing down. As the Greenland ice cap melts it floods the surface of the North Atlantic with lighter fresh water. This causes the denser conveyor waters to sink and stops the current as well as the warming effect. It is thought that this may have played a part during the Maunder Minimum, the period of nearly zero sunspot activity that coincided with the "Little Ice Age".
                            Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              One consequence of global warming I've heard about repeatedly is how with Greenland melting and all that fresh water hitting the North Atlantic, they're afraid the Gulfstream will shut down. Something about bouyancy differences between salt and fresh water might stall it. Without all that warm water traveling to the northern latitudes our friends in the UK are gonna get colder.

                              There is some evidence this has already started but I believe like everything else on this issue it's still debatable.

                              Now I'm just a common sense dummy, but tell me, if it gets colder in the North Atlantic as the Gulfstream slows .... won't the ice come back? Doesn't this seem like it could be a self regulating "natural" process?

                              In all the reports I've seen and read on this Gulfstream problem that realistic possibility hasn't been mentioned once. I'm either real stupid or common sense isn't real prevalent in the environmental scientific community.

                              SP

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X