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  • Coolant ...Strait Oil

    I'm very worried about using soluble oils on my milling machine ..
    rust issues etc ...because of no heating and intermittent use ..

    huge reservoir of evaporating water based oil, is not an option ....would put the humidity levels up etc


    was wandering about putting strait cutting oil in the sumps of these machines ..bridgeport. and the fritz werner
    so need to know
    what it costs
    what type
    how messy


    bare in mind that I'm in the uk .

    all the best.markj

  • #2
    what about covering the resevoirs? I've seen several that are basically rubber-maid plastic bins and lids w/ a small hole for wires and hose. That drastically reduces the amount of evaporation. Even better if you use a metal/aluminum lid so as the water evaporates it hits the cool metal which quickly condenses the vapor which then drips back to the resevoir. Just a thought...

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    • #3
      Originally posted by aboard_epsilon
      I'm very worried about using soluble oils on my milling machine ..
      rust issues etc ...because of no heating and intermittent use ..

      huge reservoir of evaporating water based oil, is not an option ....would put the humidity levels up etc


      was wandering about putting strait cutting oil in the sumps of these machines ..bridgeport. and the fritz werner
      so need to know
      what it costs
      what type
      how messy


      bare in mind that I'm in the uk .

      all the best.markj
      Like fasttrack said, cover the reservoir and maybe add a cheap aquarium air pump to keep the coolant airated. If you have the water soluable oil mixed correctly, rust wont be an issue, when the water evaporates it leaves a film of oil that will protect the metal.

      Comment


      • #4
        Mark, I agree with the others. I have two coolant tanks. One is covered and seldom needs topping up.
        The other..due to a screw up on my part building the tank...is still uncovered. The water from the coolant evapourates very quickly. The only time I have rust issues with this setup is when I cheat and dilute the coolant with waaay too much water. I'm talking maybe a year before this happens. I'm guessing that I lose the protective stuff when a small amount gets on the steel etc. Add that up over time and keep pouring in the water instead of trying to keep track of the coolant/water ratio and I get a very watered down coolant base.
        Russ
        I have tools I don't even know I own...

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm talking evaporation into the air whilst it is spread all over the table whist cutting.........

          say your machining for a few hours ...

          this will leave your workshop with maybe 100 percent saturated air ...


          my workshop has this gift ...if i don't use any form of heating in there nothing rusts ...

          i would like to keep it that way ...

          and maybe the strait oil will preserve not only the machine from rusting ...but have additional anti-wear properties as well .

          will be a lifetime oil ..will not grow bacteria ...

          why hasn't anyone told me the name of this oil yet ....
          i believe it was used in those swiss lathes and screw cutting machines .

          all the best.markj

          Comment


          • #6
            Sulphur threading oil comes to mind,it's what we use in all the threading machines at work,nasty foul smelling(and tasting)stuff.Things coated with it don't rust,at least not right away.It does rot the skin and ruin plastics,but most oils will.It will also grow bacteria since among other things it contains lard.

            You could buy Tapmagic cutting and sawing oil,it's clear,smells good,but still rots the skin and it's also expensive,$100+5/gallons here.

            Then pumps,typical coolant pumps made for water sol coolant don't like to pump oil,it's much more viscous.

            Sorry,but the best thing going is cling type water sol coolant.We use it by the drum full at work and never have any problems with rust on anything.

            The only time we do have a problem is with condensate when our unheated shop and tools go from winter cold to spring humidty.

            Oh,BTW,I forgot to mention smoke,that's another strike against using oil.
            I just need one more tool,just one!

            Comment


            • #7
              Cutting oil

              Originally posted by aboard_epsilon
              I'm talking evaporation into the air whilst it is spread all over the table whist cutting.........

              say your machining for a few hours ...

              this will leave your workshop with maybe 100 percent saturated air ...


              my workshop has this gift ...if i don't use any form of heating in there nothing rusts ...

              i would like to keep it that way ...

              and maybe the strait oil will preserve not only the machine from rusting ...but have additional anti-wear properties as well .

              will be a lifetime oil ..will not grow bacteria ...

              why hasn't anyone told me the name of this oil yet ....
              i believe it was used in those swiss lathes and screw cutting machines .

              all the best.markj
              Mark.

              Try these links.

              The first is a "Google" search page:
              http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=e...e+Search&meta=

              The second is one of the links from that Google search page:
              http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=2238

              There are several others in that Google page that should give you a guide as well.

              There is a current thread that is addressing this topic.
              http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/showthread.php?t=27043

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by wierdscience

                Oh,BTW,I forgot to mention smoke,that's another strike against using oil.
                That hit home. The smoke got so thick on me the other day I had to open some doors or die. I was boring a new backplate and I could tell when the cut was just about done because some of the smoke would switch and start billowing out the other end of the headstock! It was bad.

                I've been like markj. I understand his point of view completely because the idea of water on my machine tools just doesn't seem right, but the the amount of smoke I've been dealing with is way out of line. I'm gonna try some Koolmist or something ....

                SP

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                • #9
                  This is the stuff we use at work,KBC carries it.It can be mixed from 5:0 all the way to 50:1 depending on application.It's a one shot coolant,it can be used for milling,drilling,sawing,turning and grinding just by varying the concentration.

                  http://www.synlube-mi.com/Templates/coolant_king.htm


                  One other downside to oil besides smoke and being nasty is that it doesn't cool anything.
                  I just need one more tool,just one!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Fasttrack
                    what about covering the resevoirs? I've seen several that are basically rubber-maid plastic bins and lids w/ a small hole for wires and hose. That drastically reduces the amount of evaporation. Even better if you use a metal/aluminum lid so as the water evaporates it hits the cool metal which quickly condenses the vapor which then drips back to the resevoir. Just a thought...

                    Did that for my CNC desktop mill. I used a large rubbermaid container with a hole cut in the top for the return line, supply line, power cord for the pump, and air line from a small fish tank aerator. With it being sealed, I barely lost anything due to evaporation, and with the fish tank bubbler, my coolant stayed clear of bacteria for two years (only changed it cause I moved out of my apartment and wasn't about to risk spilling coolant on my belongings).

                    I've also done the cutting with straight oil in another shop, but it generates a lot of smoke, and it can't be good for you.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just make sure your return system is in good shape and even running for hours on end won't evaporate much water. If you use flood coolant then it never gets hot enough to steam the water off and the surface area of the water exposed is pretty small - just a stream and a rivulet to the return point.

                      I'm not shooting down your idea or anything, i know that some shops are very prone to rusting but if you keep everything wiped down with oil i don't think you have anything to worry about. Where ever the coolant sits it won't rust - you might notice a dark discoloration if you leave it sitting on metal for a long time but otherwise no rust. Other tools in the vicinity could rust from condensation but keep them well oiled or if they are taps/dies/cutting tools/hand tools through some camphor in the drawer/box to keep them from rusting.

                      I love water based coolant now that i made the switch - no rust and it does a wonderful job keeping stuff cool and lubricated. The heat is the major issue for me because i can't take very heavy cuts anyhow. On my little lathe i have to run a bunch of really fast light cuts to anything done fast so water based is awsome!

                      just my 2 cents - sorry i can't help with finding the oil you want.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Sorry I cant answer your question about oil but I can second what everyone else says about water based coolant. Now I would like to take this a step deeper if I may, would you guys rather use water sol. oil or syn. mix like koolmist?
                        I run koolmist for flood on my lathe and use the sol. oil for the saw.

                        I like koolmist as it seems to be cleaner (rots real quick though) then the sol. oil with little to no odor. It seems to cost more than oil. I guess I am thinking on going with one type for everything and I like the oil for the saw. I have a 5 gallon sump for the saw and it does not go bad or evaporate. The koolmist evaps very quick. I am torn and would like to know what you guys think. May help Mark to decide also.
                        Life Is Grand

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                        • #13
                          I use water soluble oil, WS-11 in fact, from Rustlick. I like it very well because it does a great job cooling, doesn't smell bad when it gets hot (too my surprise, i thought sulfurized oil would be real stinky but its not too bad at all) and i think it does a better job at lubricating. Also it doesn't disappear as fast as synthetic. And it doesn't seem to spoil too quickly - i've had a quart bottle full for 7 months now just sitting and it still looks and smells clean. I have trouble with tramp oil though because i often switch to a heavy cutting oil to do heavy drilling in the lathe or a light weight oil for tapping.

                          I've also used Rustlick SynKool - it does seem to evaporate quicker but i haven't noticed it going bad. I did have the wat. sol. oil go bad on me - it grew some black specs and started to smell funny - but the synkool always smells clean, sort of like bubble solution. It doesn't seem to lubricate as well, but that could be because a few dopes at school tend to dilute it way too much.

                          All in all, for my shop, i prefer wat. sol. because its cheaper

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've used oil for many cutting operations. When I changed to water soluable coolant the first thing that struck me was how fast the coolant drained from the chip piles. Oil doesn't do that. The chips remain an oily mess for days and are nasty to clean up.
                            Also...oily chips are a fire hazard...don't ask...
                            I have tools I don't even know I own...

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                            • #15
                              perhaps yopur parrafin heaters don't help.Alistair
                              Please excuse my typing as I have a form of parkinsons disease

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