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  • Another question - Oil

    I hope this doesn't turn into a huge argument... but ...

    Lets say that I believe in following the machine instructions, and it advises using "high quality machine grade oil with viscosity measuring 275-290 saybolt at 100 degrees F"

    What is 275-290 seconds saybolt in SAE or ISO designations? The table I was looking at suggests an SAE rating of ... 120, which can't be right!!

    Thanks guys. I thought there was a table someone posted that had conversions but maybe not; I couldn't find it.

  • #2
    Oop - Nevermind, I found the chart!

    Looks like I want an SAE 30 weight oil. I reckon ISO 68 Hydraulic oil would be ok too. Not much difference between hydraulic and machine oil, is there?

    I'm planning on vacuoline for the ways, if I can find a source. Mobil says they still make it but the usual suppliers don't carry it.

    Comment


    • #3
      As for way oil, I mixed some 15w40 and Lucas engine oil additive about 50/50, applied some on ways. Lasts 4 times longer than way oil. JIM
      jim

      Comment


      • #4
        Just use chain saw lube and Get 'R Done

        That was a joke, by the way, before Forrest jumps all over me

        Originally posted by Fasttrack
        Looks like I want an SAE 30 weight oil. I reckon ISO 68 Hydraulic oil would be ok too. Not much difference between hydraulic and machine oil, is there?
        ISO 68 and SAE 30 is the same viscosity. I think you're asking about the difference between automotive SAE 30 oil and hydraulic oils, like the Mobil DTE series. The hydraulic/machinery oils have different "add packages" with anti-friction, anti-stiction, and anti-wear ingredients.

        To make matters more complicated, Mobil's hydraulic oils, which seem to be the most common, come in "Named Series" ("Heavy", "Medium" and "Light") and "Numbered Series" (DTE 22, 24, 26). DTE Medium and DTE 24 are both ISO 68 viscosity. If you read the application sheet, there's very little difference between the two.

        Especially for a home shop, it probably doesn't matter much, as long as you get the viscosity right. My Millrite manual calls for "SAE 30" oil, but doesn't specify what kind of oil.

        My Clausing, on the other hand, specifies Mobil DTE 24 by name, which is a specific ISO 68 hydraulic oil. So I use what Clausing suggests, since the various hydraulic oils all cost roughly the same, especially if you order with free shipping from Enco.

        I'm planning on vacuoline for the ways, if I can find a source. Mobil says they still make it but the usual suppliers don't carry it.
        Mobil makes it for the printing press industry, but MSC et al don't carry it. I split a 5 gallon bucket with a friend from San Antonio -- he just called the local Mobil rep in San Antonio.
        "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

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        • #5
          Thanks Lazlo! I'll see if I can find a mobil rep around here to buy a pail of the stuff.

          I've got a bunch of Hy-Gard John Deere brand hydrualic fluid. It doesn't say what the viscosity is or anything usefull about it. I'll have to call a JD rep and see if its heavy enough. They also make a Low Viscosity Hy-Gard which seems pretty thin.

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          • #6
            McMaster-Carr carries a lot of the oddball stuff,it was the last place I bought the DTE-24.
            I just need one more tool,just one!

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            • #7
              CHAIN SAW LUBE!!! QUAAACK! Quack! Quack!Quack, quack!

              Oh! You were foolin'. Dang you Lazlo! Don't stir up grouchy old farts like that. It makes us incontinent. Now I gotta change my Depends.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Forrest Addy
                CHAIN SAW LUBE!!! QUAAACK! Quack! Quack!Quack, quack!

                Oh! You were foolin'. Dang you Lazlo! Don't stir up grouchy old farts like that. It makes us incontinent. Now I gotta change my Depends.

                I like chain saw lub on my machine ways...

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                • #9
                  Moore, of jig borer fame, sells Vacuoline. It was $25 per gallon last fall.
                  North Central Arkansas

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                  • #10
                    Note that the blurbs for vacuoline say:

                    Mobil Vacuoline 1400 Series oils are extra high performance lubricants specifically designed to satisfy the requirements of machine tools that use one oil for both hydraulic systems and way lubrication. They are formulated using high quality mineral base oils and a unique additive technology that provides excellent lubricity properties to eliminate stick-slip and chatter of heavily loaded and vertical box ways. They exhibit a high degree of oxidation and thermal stability that increases the service life and helps keep lubricated surfaces clean and free from corrosion or deposits that could detract from finished parts quality and accuracy. Mobil Vacuoline 1400 Series provide the optimum balance between these divergent requirements.

                    These products are the result of an innovative technology to meet the low frictional properties required to assure acceptable production levels of quality parts with minimum downtime in today's high output machine tools. They exhibit the ability to inhibit oxidation and the formation of lacquers and deposits on ways and in hydraulic systems while providing excellent load-carrying performance to control component wear and extend equipment service life.

                    Applications

                    * Machine tools with a common system for hydraulics and way lubrication
                    * Applications where cross-contamination of way lube with hydraulic oil can result in poor performance
                    * Machinery with separate systems for ways and hydraulics where one oil is desirable for both systems
                    * Areas where conventional mineral based lubricants are not adequately protecting way surface
                    Thus, you can use Vacuoline in more places than you think... handy if you don't want too many different pails of oil sitting about...
                    Bart Smaalders
                    http://smaalders.net/barts

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ulav8r
                      Moore, of jig borer fame, sells Vacuoline. It was $25 per gallon last fall.
                      Yowsa! Ttok (a quiet member here) and I split a 5 gallon pail of Vacuoline for $57 !
                      "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

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                      • #12
                        The manual reccomends Socony Vactra Heavy Medium X oil - what is the modern day equivalent of that?

                        I think I may just go with mobil vactra. I only need it for the slides, the vacuoline seems like over-kill.

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                        • #13
                          Vacuoline is just the old Vactra formula. Mobil took most of the tackifiers (peritack) out of the modern Vactra to satisfy EPA requirements, so it doesn't cling like it used to.

                          Another way oil that still has the tackifiers is Hangsterfers, which MSC carries:

                          http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT...MT4NO=44181540

                          MSC/Enco's house brand way oil "Tru Edge" also still has the tackifiers.

                          If you search on PM, I did a little experiment with Vacouline, Vactra, and Tru Edge, and Vacuouline and Tru Edge clung tenaciously to a piece of smooth cold rolled, and Vactra just slid down the piece.
                          "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

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                          • #14
                            By the way, I think the Lucas engine oil additive is just peritack (tackifier) in a bottle, so you can probably add the Lucas stuff to Vactra until it clings like you like:

                            Originally posted by jimmstruk
                            As for way oil, I mixed some 15w40 and Lucas engine oil additive about 50/50, applied some on ways. Lasts 4 times longer than way oil. JIM
                            "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanks Lazlo - you've been a tremendous help. Do you know what weight I should be looking for? Enco calls ISO 220 "medium" weight and since the plate says heavy medium, I'm guessing that is what I should go with.


                              I did read your previous posts about Hangsterfer's and True Edge and decided I'd buy one of those over the vactra. Vaculine has gone up alot and is hard to find. The closest mobil rep is quite a ways away.

                              Even the True Edge conventional stuff is up 60 some bucks per pail. A year ago, in the 2007 catalog, they were still 40 some bucks

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