Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Magnet motors

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    Originally posted by tdkkart
    What I can't believe is that I've just read 8 pages of a forum where grown men are blathering about something that has been proven not to work, according to existing technology.

    Don't you guys have anything else to do?? Wouldn't your time be better spent debating USA vs offshore machines or doing actual machine work??
    You're now one of us - what's your answer to your question?

    Comment


    • #77
      Who was it that mentioned bearings- of course that's the key to the whole thing. The balls have to be magnets and the races have to be made of a certain ceramic that only becomes magnetic after a short time has passed and a magnetic field has permeated the ceramic. Now when the balls pass over the ceramic, the delayed magnetic field induced repels the balls and they roll away from the field they have just induced. For the ceramic to behave this way a certain amount of heat energy has to be used, and this energy comes out of the environment.

      These special bearings ARE the motors that spin the flywheel. No crankshaft, valves, pistons, gears- and really, only one bearing assembly is required. The flywheel is only there to show that the shaft is spinning. There is no rocket science involved, just the search for this special ceramic, cerapetualium. Needles to say, you can't find it at the local drug store.

      Maybe someone could figure out how to use gadolinium in this application. Isn't there a way to use the low-grade heat from the environment to possibly shift magnetic values in the material and thus interact with permanent magnets to make a running apparatus?
      I seldom do anything within the scope of logical reason and calculated cost/benefit, etc- I'm following my passion-

      Comment


      • #78
        Are you sure it won't run. I was brave enough to show a pic.
        Nothing wrong with your building skills. Try to envision each magnet as connected to the other two by a rubber band. You even get to invert the sign of one to produce repulsion instead of attraction. With no input of energy from an outside source the three magnets will assume an equilibrium condition where the forces are all balanced.
        Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by Evan
          Nothing wrong with your building skills.
          I'd go further - I absolutely love the crankshaft in that example. I've spent an hour since seeing it trying to figure out how to make one

          Comment


          • #80
            My statement was this --- "give me a material that shields magnetism and yet is not effected by magnetism itself and I will have a working unit built by end of the day that runs till its bearings wear out"

            That statement is fact -- it would be a piece of cake --- dont argue against it -- its futile -
            I will ask again. What will make it turn? Where does the energy come from?

            A magnetic field from a permanent magnet is a static field. Static. Root word is "stasis" meaning still. Non-moving. No matter how strong or how many magnets are used they will quickly reach an equilibrium condition in which all the forces are in balance and everthing is still. Even the "magic shield" can't prevent that. It will simply be a part of the equilibrium configuration.
            Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by A.K. Boomer

              My statement was this --- "give me a material that shields magnetism and yet is not effected by magnetism itself and I will have a working unit built by end of the day that runs till its bearings wear out"
              AK, I know you will NEVER SEE this response, but..............

              That material you postulate will not help in the least, because it will not eliminate the need for energy input to move it through a magnetic field.
              1601

              Keep eye on ball.
              Hashim Khan

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by Evan
                I will ask again. What will make it turn? Where does the energy come from?

                A magnetic field from a permanent magnet is a static field. Static. Root word is "stasis" meaning still. Non-moving. No matter how strong or how many magnets are used they will quickly reach an equilibrium condition in which all the forces are in balance and everthing is still. Even the "magic shield" can't prevent that. It will simply be a part of the equilibrium configuration.


                Evan, you need to focus elsewhere -- go back to JT's post #35 and read it --- he focuses not on the fact that I could not achieve this (because I could)
                He focuses on the improbability or impossibility for such a material to exist --- This is what your all arguing (whether you realize it or not)
                JT cuts through the chase and gets to the point ---

                I am pretty sure that ANY material, no matter how"unobtanium" it is, that shields against a magnetic field, will require energy to push it into place..... and that (if nothing else) will provide the losses that destroy perpetual motion.

                Now -- getting back to your original question of "What will make it turn? Where does the energy come from?"

                If this magic material or combinations and configurations of materials or whatever was ever discovered (which would directly disobey or disrupt many of the laws of physics and thermal dynamics - but thats beside the point as my statement stated "give me this material" ) I would then indeed have a material that can be "slipped in between" a permanent magnet and its repelling or attracting counterpart without any frictional dividend to pay what-so-ever ,,, this would allow for energies to be utilized either in the repelling or attracting mode and then NO dividend for either retracting the attracting magnets (or magnet and ferrous material) Or pre-lining up the repelling magnets and then removing said shield from them ----
                To give you a mechanical example lets use GT2rides unit as he was not only "brave" enough to put it on -- its a neat little example and he's worked hard on it and I commend you all for treating him with respect.

                Imagine his fluctuating rotary apparatus controlling a shield device instead of magnets --- It opens and allows two attracting magnets (one in the piston and one in the "head") to draw the piston up to TDC and then the shield is slipped into place and the piston gets to move away freely -------- power is produced and the cycle is ready to repeat itself --- want more? Imagine the same situation with a twist --- literally -- Two attracting magnets - one in the piston and one in the head (with the rotary shield in between) This time the heads magnet is rotatable and is timed to the crank like a camshaft except with a stable position for most of the duration and then a "quick flip" mechanism ------ the two attracting magnets draw the piston up to TDC and like the first unit power is produced - the rotary shield is then slipped in between the two and then the heads magnet does a brief 180 and then holds position - the magnets are now lines up to "hate each other" the shield is then removed and power is now made on the downstroke as well.......

                This is basically just an exercise in elementary mechanical engineering --- it holds as true as the statement I gave.

                My only difference is when debating whether we know everything we ever will --- I dont feel like we do -- will it make a difference with something of this nature -- i would rather use the term "improbable" NOT impossible
                Personally I like putting that last .01% up on a shelf somewhere --- it keeps me on my toes and keeps my mind active --- even if it is floating out in space sometimes -- its always proven to be an enjoyable ride

                Comment


                • #83
                  Originally posted by J Tiers
                  AK, I know you will NEVER SEE this response, but..............

                  That material you postulate will not help in the least, because it will not eliminate the need for energy input to move it through a magnetic field.

                  That wasnt part of the statement -- I stated "give me a shielding material that is not effected"


                  You have to state what you stated before - that its either improbable or impossible to have such material.

                  I do read your stuff JT, and you make good sense.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    One can hypothesize many amazing devices if physics can be ignored. This is akin to doing some really bitchen' math and ignoring those pesky divide-by-zero issues.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Although GT2ride has shown --- It can not only be a great mechanical engineering design exercise for the brain, You can prove it to be far more efficient than some hillbillies "air engine" that simply gobbles coal from the power plant to do the exact same -- absolutely nothing, I ask you this, what motor is more efficient?

                      I think then for most it might just be people like to build mechanical stuff with their machinery? Given also that iv actually seen my share of "finger engines" on this site --- Once again - just a little perspective thats all.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by A.K. Boomer
                        My statement was this --- "give me a material that shields magnetism and yet is not effected by magnetism itself and I will have a working unit built by end of the day that runs till its bearings wear out"
                        AK, I'm hesitant to jump into this quagmire, and I admire your tenacity, but you're fighting a fundamental law of nature: the second law of thermodynamics - in an isolated system (i.e., a mechanism), energy disperses over time. Bart quoted this in perfect Dilbert form on page 1: you can't break even.

                        Closely related to that is the law of conservation of energy: the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant. I.e., energy cannot be created or destroyed, it can only change form (from kinetic, to thermal, for example).

                        So even if you got a propulsive system worked out, you're inevitably going to dissipate energy due to friction...
                        "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by dp
                          I'm not aware of any material that shields magnetic fields completely. Any material that is used as a shield and which can be induced to generate it's own magnetic field from eddie currents will be attracted to a magnet and as such is not a candidate.
                          That's right -- materials like Mu Metal and MetGlas aren't really magnetic shields. They have extremely high permeability, so they pull the magnetic fields to themselves as they magnetize, which creates an area of lower magnetic field in their vicinity.
                          "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            i've not got any magnets here to experiment with ..
                            but what about a double layer of fine steel mesh.

                            it works in a davey lamp

                            all the best.markj

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              And once again -- you miss the entire point, Lazlo - its more of an exercise in mechanical engineering as that is the only thing I have to use to back up my statement. Once again -- re-read the statement --- it is a hypothetical answer to a hypothetical question - Actuality does not enter the equation in the form or whether or not said material exist or could ever be found or even if all the laws that we have today prove it cannot exist --- thats not what were after here -- or if any of you guys have misguided yourselves in that direction -- good luck with that.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                see next post
                                Last edited by NickH; 02-10-2009, 12:51 PM.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X