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5MT x ER32 headstock adaptor and draw tube

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  • 5MT x ER32 headstock adaptor and draw tube

    The title says it all!. Not sure if I'm reinventing the wheel here, but I wanted to be able to use my ER32 collets as pass through collets in the headstock.

    This project was partly inspired by Sir John's 5C x ER32 adaptor, and basically combines that adaptor and the 5MT x 5C adaptor into one unit.


    Maritool 10mm collet, ER32 nut, 40 x 1.5 thread, flats for just in case, 5MT taper


    Draw tube was a piece of heavy wall black 1" bore pipe, connection to the handwheel end is by puddle weld. At the 5MT end I used a 32 x 1.5 thread, if you already had 5C stuff you would probably try to stick with the 5C thread.

    At the left of the draw tube the steel is turned to be a sliding fit in the tailstock tube, and the flange bears on the end of the tailstock tube.


    The aluminium handwheel is secured with 2 x M6 cap screws, and a 1/2" hole is drilled right through so I can use a 12mm tommy bar if need be. I left a 30mm dia x 20mm recess with M5 grub screw in the end so I can fit a bush to support thin stuff as required.


    The moment of truth, checking run out with a piece of 10mm drill rod/silver steel. Right at the collet I have TIR of .005mm or 2 tenths, 50mm out I have .02mm or 8 tenths.

  • #2
    If that works for You, +

    Amazing how many people freak over tenths, when .001 Inch works for 90% of anything a HSM will Do...

    Precision Roller/Ball Bearing Seat/Bore Work of course, is Ground in the Tenths (100ths for MM....)

    Direct Spindle/Collet Runout... is Ground for touchy Jobs...

    The slightly rough turned finish on that Taper, is nothing to brag about...

    If you are Not Grinding a Surface for a Collet to seat on ID or OD , You are just running at normal Lathe Operating Specifications...

    Nice Lathe work as it is Kind of a Waste of a Maritool Collet...

    Other end of the World...

    Edit... I Claim No Micron Accuracy or Such, But I do Make a little $$ ...

    Still, Nice Work....
    Last edited by Bguns; 03-02-2009, 08:00 AM.

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    • #3
      Nice job Bob, and thanks for posting it here.

      Ignore the negative response from Mr. Bguns, he is more than willing to make comments such as this on several boards, yet never seems to show any of his work. Sharing tips and projects is one of the major functions of this board.

      I do not understand his comment regarding the waste of a Maritool collet. The 5C collet system is in widespread use, but the ER system is an improvement for many reasons. The major drawback is the lack of tooling such as this to adapt it for use on a lathe. Anybody just starting to tool up would do well to make such an adaptor and use ER tooling rather than go to the expense of buying a thousand 5C collets.
      Jim H.

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      • #4
        The major drawback is the lack of tooling such as this to adapt it for use on a lathe.
        Whats wrong with THIS in a 4-jaw? Done all the time in the shops I've worked at.

        Edit: BTW nicely done, Bob.
        Last edited by moldmonkey; 03-02-2009, 01:55 PM.
        Jon Bohlander
        My PM Blog

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        • #5
          There is nothing "wrong" with that, except it costs $144.00. A HSM adaptor can be made for a fraction of that.

          Using that in a four jaw also precludes getting close in as a spindle mounted unit will allow, and you might not be as willing to rev that four jaw up to a couple of thousand RPM when working on the small parts that collets are usually used for.
          Jim H.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by moldmonkey
            Whats wrong with THIS in a 4-jaw? Done all the time in the shops I've worked at.

            Edit: BTW nicely done, Bob.

            Maybe just the lack of pass though and the setup time?

            Yes ..nice work Bob...
            Last edited by lakeside53; 03-02-2009, 02:20 PM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by JCHannum
              the ER system is an improvement for many reasons.... use ER tooling rather than go to the expense of buying a thousand 5C collets.
              Looks like a nice job to me and ER collets have their place. As far as ER being an improvement over 5C, just tell me where to get square, hex and soft ER collets. Can't do step collets since the nut has to fit over the front. They have a good grip range and hold well but are not a replacement for 5C.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Just Bob Again
                As far as ER being an improvement over 5C, just tell me where to get square, hex and soft ER collets. Can't do step collets since the nut has to fit over the front. They have a good grip range and hold well but are not a replacement for 5C.
                Agree completely -- I have, and use, both. 5C also has the huge advantage in that it's threaded by the tail, so you can clamp it by a drawbar, therefore allowing a quick-change of workpiece via a lever-operated drawbar (i.e., the most common 5C lathe setup).

                With an ER chuck, you have to unscrew the nose cap, even if you use a 5C->ER adapter.
                Last edited by lazlo; 03-02-2009, 03:14 PM.
                "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did."

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                • #9
                  There probably never will be a be-all, end-all workholding system. All have their positive and negative aspects. The 5C excels in some areas, while the ER does in others. The 5C is limited in the dimensions a single collet will hold, while a few ER's can cover a wider range. The ER is limited in the shapes it can currently hold and the lack of pot collets. Both arguments are valid.
                  Jim H.

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                  • #10
                    I just want to make it clear, I wasn't "dissing" the OPs work or anyone else who has made one. I see where it might have come off that way from the tone of that first response. I often see the idea that the only way to use ERs in a lathe is to make a dedicated holder and wanted to give guys who might be considering one some food for thought. For those that may be considering making vs. buying, I'll respond to a couple of the perceived drawbacks and then I'll shut up.

                    Access to the workpiece is a draw as it is the same collet nut.

                    I'll agree on the cost if it's used on only one machine but the beauty of a straight shank is that just one collet chuck can be used on multiple machines and accessories (dividing heads, etc.). A smaller series/shank can even be used in 5C collets and all the accessories that use them.

                    Top speed and less hangout comes down in favor of a dedicated holder.

                    It is possible to get Er collet chucks that allow pass through of the work. They generally have a larger shank for that series than the others though.

                    Setup is a draw??? For less critical work, nothing is simpler that throwing the collet chuck in a 3jaw.

                    A dedicated holder is machined in the machine that uses it. A collet chuck in a lathe chuck/another collet does allow more chances for error/runout. So advantage dedicated holder.

                    A commercial product will be hardened and ground. Advantage collet chuck.

                    Hijack over.
                    Last edited by moldmonkey; 03-02-2009, 08:54 PM.
                    Jon Bohlander
                    My PM Blog

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by JCHannum
                      There probably never will be a be-all, end-all workholding system. All have their positive and negative aspects. The 5C excels in some areas, while the ER does in others. The 5C is limited in the dimensions a single collet will hold, while a few ER's can cover a wider range. The ER is limited in the shapes it can currently hold and the lack of pot collets. Both arguments are valid.
                      JC's post explains it all in a nutshell.
                      The first line especially.

                      As many know I am a big believer in the ER system but I still use 5C's for some applications where the ER's are not suitable.

                      I think their main claim to fame as regards a HSM'er is the versatility when starting out.
                      For a set price you get less collets covering more range that can be used for both work holding and tool holding, ie works on both lathe and mill.

                      None of the other series 5C, R8 etc can claim this so for a minimum outlay you can be up and running.

                      4 collets, 6-7mm will hold 1/4" and 6mm
                      9-10 will hold 3/8" and 10mm
                      12-13 will hold 1/2" and 12mm
                      and 15-16 will hold 5/8" and 16mm

                      which are 8 of the most common milling cutter shank sizes.
                      You can add later as your needs require.

                      .
                      .

                      Sir John , Earl of Bligeport & Sudspumpwater. MBE [ Motor Bike Engineer ] Nottingham England.



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                      • #12
                        Excellent work Bob....I have an ER40 collet chuck that came with my milling machine....I might make up something like that for my lathe....
                        Precision takes time.

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