Shop Made Tools

[BCRider]

Plastics and metals can collect water. It's most likely the collets that would do it in the case shown. But the combination of metal tools and a wood holder seems to work well in the usual sorts of medium to high humidity.

I wasn't going the theorize, but I will..... the surface of the metal or plastic holder is often smooth, neatly made to conform to the surface of what it is holding. So condensation can wick in, and then does not evaporate quickly. Wood has a rougher surface, and may let any condensation evaporate more easily, not holding water by wicking action.

Wood won't help you if your shop is open and under a dock at the seashore, however. There are limits. Damp wood will definitely cause rust if in contact with steel, but wood may wick away minor amounts of water into the wood, away from the metal.

Wood, once dried, tends to maintain a low water content even in high humidity environments.

Some additional thoughts on using wood as tool holders and cases that Jerry's post brought up in my mind.

Some woods have strong rust causing tanins in the wood makeup. So those should be avoided. Red oak is one that jumps to my mind but there are others and I'm sure a little checking around will suggest those to avoid.

The bit about the tools fitting tight in the wood pockets does raise a good concern. First off wood and some plastics do in fact take in moisture from the air. And under a change in conditions expel the moisture. Wood "breathes" moisture. It doesn't generate it but it responds to local changes in temperature and humidity to take in and give out this moisture. So the holes or other cutouts for tools should not be so snug that air cannot get in and aid with carrying away said moisture. There's another reason the holes or cutouts should not be a tight fit. Wood swells and shrinks across the grain with changes in humidity. A perfect fit when made can become a death grip on the item under the wrong conditions. So don't make the fits super close. Give the parts in the holders/cases some rattle room to aid with both issues.

Oil on the metal items will soak into the wood holders and never dry. This is fine. But said oil also holds onto dust and grit. So it's wise to finish the wood in a drying oil such as boiled linseed or polymerized tung or multiple coats of the thinned down paint store style "tung" or "danish" oil finishes. Or a quicker option is two or three coats of thinned down polyurethane varnish or thinned oil based paint. Thinning these products increases the soaking in factor and reduces how much they build up and make cavities tighter. Thinning the products also speeds up the drying time provided you paint the items and then wipe away any excess pooling in the cavities.

[Cenedd]

Here are some mill table covers I made for my Little Machine Shop 5500 series mill. 6061 Aluminum.

Aw Dave, what are you doing to my 'when I get round to it' list?! You've set the bar pretty high too. Have you thought about adding some sides to the top face so that the things you probably shouldn't be putting down on the table, but do, don't roll off? The screw heads might already be enough, but just a thought.

[J Tiers]

There is a problem with such holders, at least here in Sydney, Aus. If the humidity is medium-high, you can get a slight amount of moisture building up between the collet and the holder, and over time that becomes rust. Very distressing, and much effort needed to remove it safely.

I ended up with a more conventional 'rack' for the collets, made of hardwood and enclosed in a box also made of hardwood, with a clear plastic lid (well, moderately clear, as it was second-hand). Yes, wood could get damp too, but not when it has been soaked in oil! And I keep a block of camphor inside the box to further prevent any rust. The combination seems to work. ER25 set plus ER11 set.

.....................

Cheers
Roger

Plastics and metals can collect water. It's most likely the collets that would do it in the case shown. But the combination of metal tools and a wood holder seems to work well in the usual sorts of medium to high humidity.

I wasn't going the theorize, but I will..... the surface of the metal or plastic holder is often smooth, neatly made to conform to the surface of what it is holding. So condensation can wick in, and then does not evaporate quickly. Wood has a rougher surface, and may let any condensation evaporate more easily, not holding water by wicking action.

Wood won't help you if your shop is open and under a dock at the seashore, however. There are limits. Damp wood will definitely cause rust if in contact with steel, but wood may wick away minor amounts of water into the wood, away from the metal.

Wood, once dried, tends to maintain a low water content even in high humidity environments.

[Dave94Lightning]

Here are some mill table covers I made for my Little Machine Shop 5500 series mill. 6061 Aluminum.

[JRouche]

Would plastic work? I am sure it would - with added oil of course to displace any moisture. You would need a large block though. Could be $$.

I think you nailed it. Winters are not always about the cold. You can dye of dehydration in the dead od winter also, JR

[rcaffin]

It's a single bit of hardwood, left over from building our house I think. Great fun with sharp (ie aluminium) milling cutters of various sizes.
The clear plastic lid (visible at the top) fits into the recess at the top edges. A tab sticks out at the left to make it easy to select the collet I want.
As you can see, the holes are all labeled in sequence, and the collets are metric. The holes at the LH end are for additional 6, 10 & 12 mm, as these are the main shank sizes from the R8 days.
The collets at the RH edge are imperial. The ones across the top are ER11. Sometimes you need a smaller collet holder to get into corners.

Would plastic work? I am sure it would - with added oil of course to displace any moisture. You would need a large block though. Could be $$.

I used wood because I tend to have a bit of it lying around for free - we live on a farm. The camphor is not shown in the photo: a block of it wrapped up in AlFoil with a small hole in the top. With the lid in place the vapour tends to accumulate nicely.

Cheers
Roger

[Tundra Twin Track]

There is a problem with such holders, at least here in Sydney, Aus. If the humidity is medium-high, you can get a slight amount of moisture building up between the collet and the holder, and over time that becomes rust. Very distressing, and much effort needed to remove it safely.

I ended up with a more conventional 'rack' for the collets, made of hardwood and enclosed in a box also made of hardwood, with a clear plastic lid (well, moderately clear, as it was second-hand). Yes, wood could get damp too, but not when it has been soaked in oil! And I keep a block of camphor inside the box to further prevent any rust. The combination seems to work. ER25 set plus ER11 set.

Getting the sticky labels to 'stick' to the oily wood was the hard part!



Cheers
Roger

Very nicely done, would UHMW or High Density Plastic collect moisture like wood, my thoughts would be no.

[davidwdyer]

Ipé wood is also very hard and I machine it. Sometimes use it in place of aluminum.

[Cenedd]

Oooo beautiful wood work! That is a skill I never really had....

Yes you do, you're just trying to think about it like a woodworker when you're a metalworker. Get yourself a nice hard wood (preferably one that has no known toxicity/allergy issues - check on The Wood Database by searching for the wood in the top right corner) and treat it like aluminium. I like Mopane as it's hard, looks nice and machines beautifully. Aluminium profile as it's sharper. Mill it, flycut it. As long as you can get it out of a single block, it's all familiar. If not, you're into the dark art of joinery but even then you can cheat with glue, screws or pins. Do make sure you've got some form of dust extraction or respirator though as the saw dust is liable to get you in the end otherwise.
I can't tell from the picture whether Roger's is one piece or a tray added in but it's much nicer than any of the options I've seen lately!

I need to find a way to store my ER collets, right now they simply sit out on the bench.

I want to do something nicer but my current stop-gap is a pair of round icecube trays (rectangular trays, round icecubes) someone on here (I believe) recommended. One's a bit flimsy but nested they work. Not perfect but a lot better than they were until I 'get round to it'!

[nickel-city-fab]

Oooo beautiful wood work! That is a skill I never really had.... up here we get humidity too, jammed in between the Great Lakes with a west wind. Camphor is the oldest trick in the book, and very effective. I need to find a way to store my ER collets, right now they simply sit out on the bench.

[rcaffin]

There is a problem with such holders, at least here in Sydney, Aus. If the humidity is medium-high, you can get a slight amount of moisture building up between the collet and the holder, and over time that becomes rust. Very distressing, and much effort needed to remove it safely.

I ended up with a more conventional 'rack' for the collets, made of hardwood and enclosed in a box also made of hardwood, with a clear plastic lid (well, moderately clear, as it was second-hand). Yes, wood could get damp too, but not when it has been soaked in oil! And I keep a block of camphor inside the box to further prevent any rust. The combination seems to work. ER25 set plus ER11 set.

Getting the sticky labels to 'stick' to the oily wood was the hard part!



Cheers
Roger

[Cenedd]

What's the life expectancy of the plastic? Is it affected by: temperature. moisture, UV?
I'd hate to see my 5V or B&S #9 collets which aren't made anymore dumped on the floor due to plastic degradation..

Depends on the material Reggie. The 'default' is PLA which is nominally biodegradable....but isn't unless you stick it in an industrial composter apparently. PLA is fast to print, rigid (also a bit brittle) and cheap. PETG is a bit tougher and also less rigid - but the bit of flex in it can also be useful. You can also print ABS but it can be a bit noxious so you really need extraction and also it prefers being enclosed as temp changes can make it warp and then the layers can come apart. Plenty other engineering plastics like nylon and carbon fibre laced stuff for strength. I suspect that a lot of what we're printing will still be around long after we're gone....which is both good and bad.

[reggie_obe]

Surprised I'm not seeing more 3D printed stuff as this thread enters the 21st century. It's really useful for work holding or positioning jigs for irregular shaped workpieces etc... Here's a quick Collet turntable I designed because I was tired of having them laying all over my mill table.

What's the life expectancy of the plastic? Is it affected by: temperature. moisture, UV?
I'd hate to see my 5V or B&S #9 collets which aren't made anymore dumped on the floor due to plastic degradation..

[Cenedd]

Surprised I'm not seeing more 3D printed stuff as this thread enters the 21st century. It's really useful for work holding or positioning jigs for irregular shaped workpieces etc

Also good for prototyping things so you know you haven't had some sort of brain-fart with the design of the dimensions. Nice. Might have to adapt your idea of the R8 collet holder for ER32's. Have seen R8 racks like that and have been 3D printing.....but haven't put the two things together yet.

[Dave94Lightning]

Surprised I'm not seeing more 3D printed stuff as this thread enters the 21st century. It's really useful for work holding or positioning jigs for irregular shaped workpieces etc... Here's a quick Collet turntable I designed because I was tired of having them laying all over my mill table.