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  • I popped a small roast into the over and it will soon be popped into my belly!
    Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

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    • Originally posted by Cenedd View Post

      I think you're investigating the wrong thing there Paul. My concern would be why the breakers didn't trip and hence how long would it take for either parts of my body to melt enough to act as a fuse or alternatively whether unattended things would stop sizzling before they set light to the rest of the house! How old are the breakers and could you retrofit an RCD (or replace entirely with something that had one)? Glad everything's ok though.
      Arcing faults seldom trip the breaker as they act like a load, hence why arcing faults are the leading cause of electrical fires.
      You can melt a lot of metal @<20A before the thermal portion of the breaker trips. When the rain stopped the heat likely dried up the water and ceased the fault before the breaker even got hot.
      Cheers,
      Jon

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      • Sand wasn't coming out of the sandblast pot.

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        • Originally posted by Ridgerunner View Post
          Sand wasn't coming out of the sandblast pot.

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          Don't eat it. You might end up patient zero for covid-20.
          Tom - Spotsylvania, VA

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          • Yes, a 20 amp breaker can hold as much as 50-60 amps for 10-20 seconds. 50 amps at 120 volts is 6000 watts. And the plug blades may be something other than brass, although they have the characteristic golden color. There are actually two fairly new breakers in series on that circuit. There are two breakers at the service entrance, one on each "phase", which feeds 240 VAC through about 100 feet of #12-2 UF cable to another breaker box in my other house, where the workshop is located. That underground feeder is a temporary hookup, although it has been in place for well over 20 years. So there is probably 150 feet of #12 wire from the 100 amp service to the outlet where the reel was plugged in then add maybe 20 feet of #16 AWG wire, The combination has a resistance of almost 1 ohm, so the maximum current into a short is about 120 amps, which probably would cause an instantaneous or very short time delay trip. But apparently it was a higher resistance fault that generated a lot of heat in a small area which melted the metal blade as well as some of the incoming hot wire.

            Hey, I just did my first welding job! How do you like those beads at the bottom of the plastic case?!
            http://pauleschoen.com/pix/PM08_P76_P54.png
            Paul , P S Technology, Inc. and MrTibbs
            USA Maryland 21030

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            • Originally posted by Ridgerunner View Post
              Sand wasn't coming out of the sandblast pot.
              I'll see your sandblast pot and raise you a dishwasher...AFTER the internal filter which in theory means it came up the drain.

              Originally posted by PStechPaul View Post
              Hey, I just did my first welding job! How do you like those beads at the bottom of the plastic case?! [/SIZE]
              Needs some of that welder's anti-stick stuff!
              I'll admit I'm certainly not a qualified electrician but I'm surprised it's so long. I'm pretty sure the stuff here is required to trip faster than that - although similarly it will take over current for a while. If anything stuff trips too fast in certain situations. Used to have issues with RCDs tripping if a bulb blew sometimes. May have to do my research to see if I'm just ignorant or its different standards (and to be clear, I mean standards as in specs rather than implying ours is better than your or vise versa).

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              • Originally posted by flathead4 View Post

                Don't eat it. You might end up patient zero for covid-20.
                Too late. 🙄

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                • Originally posted by Cenedd View Post


                  I'll see your sandblast pot and raise you a dishwasher...AFTER the internal filter which in theory means it came up the drain.

                  .
                  I'll see your dishwasher and raise you a horrible story. I wanted to put in a new water line at the house. I had some left over 1" K soft copper in a roll down at my farm. After I put in the new water line my wife was complaining about the flow being low. I was to busy at the time to really look in to it and because I did not have another water filter on hand I just took the old one out. This improved things a bit. About 3 days later I was getting a shower and noticed little hairs sticking out of the shower nozzle. I realized what was happening and also realized we had been drinking the water for those 3 days. 🙄

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                  • Ew, nasty. Many years ago when I lived with my mum, the cat (whichever of many it may have been at the time - she worked at a vets) brought home a mouse or a rat - I forget which but it was tiny either way. This wouldn't have been unusual but it let it go mostly unharmed. Again, not unusual but this time it got into bed with my mum and come the morning when she suddenly realised she'd been sleeping with said rodent...well, let's just say that my ears are still ringing!
                    Also had a frog flushed into a friend's toilet. The odd thing here was that it was alive and perfectly unharmed.... apparently that shows the water is fresh!

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                    • Two years ago I bought an 8” chuck with 2 piece reversible jaws. Once I set it up on the D1-4 it had .0007 tir so I was happy.
                      Two weeks ago I put in a precision ground shaft and somehow had .009 tir. I took the whole chuck apart, cleaned it and wound up with .005 when I reassembled.
                      So I put it together 6 ways from Sunday and got the same result each time. Then I took each jaw and marked them up as to positional error.

                      Today I dressed a 15mm radius on my surface grinder and took .0032 off one jaw and .0012 off another. I left one untouched.

                      I now have .0008 tir so I’m happy again.

                      On a previous note... If you grew up or spent any time in the Buffalo/Niagara area, you probably ate roast beef on a Kummelweck roll.
                      Being a Niagara boy and now living in “Occupied Mexico”, I miss my Beef on Weck. There’s a Charlie the Butcher off the SE corner of Buffalo Airport. Always my first stop after of the car rental.
                      Tim The Grim
                      Senior Member
                      Last edited by Tim The Grim; 04-29-2020, 07:53 PM.
                      Illigitimi non Carborundum 😎
                      9X49 Birmingham Mill, Reid Model 2C Grinder, 13x40 ENCO GH Lathe, 6X18 Craftsman lathe, Sherline CNC mill, Eastwood TIG200 AC/DC and lots of stuff from 30+ years in the trade and 15.5 in refinery unit operations. Now retired. El Paso, TX

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Jon Heron View Post

                        Arcing faults seldom trip the breaker as they act like a load, hence why arcing faults are the leading cause of electrical fires.
                        You can melt a lot of metal @<20A before the thermal portion of the breaker trips. When the rain stopped the heat likely dried up the water and ceased the fault before the breaker even got hot.
                        Cheers,
                        Jon
                        Yep. The arc has a voltage drop, so the various resistances may not see the full line voltage, and current will be correspondingly lower.

                        Then the breaker has a trip characteristic that is rather slow for a "low" overload. It is faster for a high current. They are responsive to time and current. And, of course, there are some that are just not responsive to anything.

                        Paul, do I not recall that you were the one who had a Federal Pacific Electric box? Or one of the related sub-brands? Those after a time, especially in a humid environment, may never trip at all. They are supposed to be trashed wherever found...... If you do have one, your experience is a really good reason to get rid of that box and put in a decent one. I am partial to Square-D (not the "Homeline" sub brand), but there are other usable brands
                        3313 5160 4357 4344 3174 9120

                        Keep eye on ball.
                        Hashim Khan

                        Everything not impossible is compulsory

                        Birds are NOT real, they are spying on you

                        Comment


                        • Today I "officially" made my shop metric. I have had metric measuring devices for decades, starting back in the early 1960s. And I have metric taps. And have made metric parts. I even have a Unimat lathe/milling machine/etc. But up until recently I only had one or two metric drill bits. So a few months ago I purchased a nice metric drill index with Viking Ultra Bor, split point bits from 1mm to 10mm by 0.5mm steps. But it had six empty holes to go up to 13mm so I ordered those six missing bits from McMaster and they came in today.

                          So I filled up my first metric drill index today. And I now count my shop as "officially" metric.

                          And the trumpets blare!

                          I may get into that scraping thing sometime soon.
                          Paul A.
                          SE Texas

                          And if you look REAL close at an analog signal,
                          You will find that it has discrete steps.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Paul Alciatore View Post
                            So I filled up my first metric drill index today. And I now count my shop as "officially" metric.
                            And the trumpets blare!
                            I may get into that scraping thing sometime soon.
                            Dogs and cats living together. In my lifetime, Man walked on the Moon, the Pope died, and the White Sox won the World Series, the Berlin Wall fell, and now Paul goes metric. I think I'll stick around to see what happens next.
                            25 miles north of Buffalo NY, USA

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                            • I didn't take any pictures, but I helped a buddy brake some sheet metal parts (I have a hard time calling 12 gage sheet, but its not really plate yet either) for something on his boat trailer. They were an odd shape so I couldn't just do it all on the box brake. I had to use the vise brake to do part of it. Had a pretty good cheater bar on the Columbia bench vise to make the short bends. I never thought I would get as much work as I do out of that bench vise brake, but sometimes its just so handy being open ended and relatively small. The Tennsmith made short work of the long bends. It was almost anti climactic how easily it bent it.

                              Then I setup a big piece of flat bar to drill holes for tapping and mounting handles on the end.

                              Now I am running a job to cut a fixture plate for 8 inch wide bar stock. Right now its roughing the clearance area below the ledges where the bar stock and the edge clamps will go.

                              I also ran a load of dishes and two loads of laundry. LOL.
                              Bob La Londe
                              Senior Member
                              Last edited by Bob La Londe; 04-29-2020, 11:44 PM.
                              *** I always wanted a welding stinger that looked like the north end of a south bound chicken. Often my welds look like somebody pointed the wrong end of a chicken at the joint and squeezed until something came out. Might as well look the part.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Paul Alciatore View Post
                                Today I "officially" made my shop metric.

                                So I filled up my first metric drill index today. And I now count my shop as "officially" metric.

                                And the trumpets blare!
                                It's good to see you've seen the light Paul. I mean obviously it's the correct system because it's the one I'm using and therefore everyone else is wrong!

                                Ironically I've been forced into UNC work lately as the stuff I've been fixing and/modifying was made in the US of A. Very irritating when you find out that none of your existing tooling or stock of screws is going to fit.....as I'm sure you've experienced previously in reverse!

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