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  • Need help identifying Valenite insert holder

    In a frustrated moment last night, I began digging through some archives and came across this insert holder. I was fully confident that Google would yield all the info on this holder I would need, but alas.....NADA. I understand from some posts that perhaps Valenite was bought out by Kennametal, who may have killed off a bunch of Valenite's product lines, etc.

    In any event, I'm a lost pup. I'm an insert newbie on top of that. Any way of determining a current insert number/type? Looks like a pretty good holder, so I'd hate to relegate it back to the "I'll get to that later" pile. It's obviously a threading insert: thickness .125 and mounting hole looks to be .0875. I have a bolt threading project coming up, and I thought I might give an insert a try.


    Wayne

  • #2
    You'll need to start by figuring the IC or inscribed circle.That is the largest circle that will fit inside the bounds of the insert shape.Usually its something common like 1/4-3/8-1/2 etc.

    The rest of the info needed to spec an insert can be found here-

    http://www.carbidedepot.com/formulas-insert-d.htm
    I just need one more tool,just one!

    Comment


    • #3
      Sorry
      I do not think it's a threading tool.
      The insert look like a TNMG-332...
      The holder MTENN negative cutter.
      Great for chamfers.
      e
      please visit my webpage:
      http://motorworks88.webs.com/

      Comment


      • #4
        Well.....my newbie insert label is still intact. From my continuing research, It thought an MTENN was a threading holder.....maybe not.

        I did find out from Walter, who apparently consumed Valenite, that it takes a TNMG222, recommended M3 for threading. Does that shed any light?

        All that having been said, what does one suggest for threading inserts in low to medium carbon steel? I'm finding this stuff is incredibly proprietary and confusing to say the least. If you get a holder, are you married to that maker's inserts? Big time ignorance being shown here......so easy on me.
        Wayne

        Comment


        • #5
          Ok
          Pleae tell me what you plan to thread
          i.e size and pitch
          and I will try and help
          eddie
          please visit my webpage:
          http://motorworks88.webs.com/

          Comment


          • #6
            That is not a threading insert are holder . Standerd turning and champfering. insert .
            Every Mans Work Is A Portrait of Him Self
            http://sites.google.com/site/machinistsite/TWO-BUDDIES
            http://s178.photobucket.com/user/lan...?sort=3&page=1

            Comment


            • #7
              You have a very old one.

              JL...........

              Comment


              • #8
                You're right. It's an antique, but apparently functional.

                Anyway, the project is 1 1/4" X 7 TPI Grade 5 steel, 5" of thread.

                Should I look at insert, carbide brazed tip, or just stick to HSS?
                Wayne

                Comment


                • #9
                  Ok
                  Are you extending an existing threads? Or making bolts...
                  If you are extending threads..(something I do a lot of for local ship yard) then use the brazed on carbides. I just picked up 10 pcs for 25.00 at Travers in the us.
                  Bolts are made from the worse material So getting a nice thread is not easy.Coolant/oil helps. HHS is great if u have the time to sharpen...I never do..
                  And if you need info on an insert system let me know.
                  eddie
                  please visit my webpage:
                  http://motorworks88.webs.com/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Unfortunately, I'll be threading from blanks. You're absolutely correct about the material. I've already experimented with some existing bolts, and they are nasty looking threads. I'm going to talk to the customer about 12L14, but I fear the wear factor is going to eliminate that idea. This is only a quantity of six so, using a better material and then heat treating is also probably out. The threads that I cut on the test bolt were functional, but I would sure hate to have my name on 'em anywhere.

                    My experience on carbide brazed tips when threading a low grade steel has been a lot of chipping of the carbide. Could be, I just had a lousy grade of bit. As I said, I'm a newbie on inserts, so whatever guidance you have, I'd appreciate.
                    Wayne

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Threading tools come in lots of different flavors but they have many things in common. They are pointed with the angle for the type thread probably in your case a 60°. They have side relief built in which your turning insert does not.
                      1. HSS works great but is a little more difficult to grind into the threading configuration.
                      2. The brazed carbide threading tools are fairly cheep and workable but they also require sharpening which gets back to grinding.
                      3. Insert type threading tools avoid the sharpening/grinding problem but cost more and come in numerous different configurations and holding methods. There are vertical, lay down in both partial and full profile, external, internal, Top lock …..etc.
                      If you want to start with an insert type tool the top lock type or full profile lay down type are probably a little more state of the art. I personally prefer the vertical threading inserts.

                      I would suggest that you get some cheap material and practice on that. Bolts are not all that expensive but most likely you will make some scrap during the learning process. The nice thing is that you can turn it down and start over on a smaller size.

                      The 1" material is a good size to start on but even something that large bends a little. Minimuize both your material and tool extensions and run a center if you can. Take some repeat passes with out advancing the cutter and you will probably see some additional material being removed.

                      Best wishes,
                      Byron Boucher
                      Burnet, TX

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Good friendly metals

                        Two materials that I like to work with are 416 stainless and 1144 Stressproof. I get the 416 in the 1 1/4" size from the waterwell irrigation people who use it. The stress proof I buy from online metals. I don't know what the material is but that used to make mud pump rods machines very nicely.
                        Byron Boucher
                        Burnet, TX

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          While the LTE-8 holder is not intended to be a threading tool holder, but in this instance it can be used IF you get an insert with no more than a .0179" radius on the tips.

                          I've found that holder in my "Turning 2007" Valenite catalog. The insert spec posted is correct, though you could also use a TNMP221, TNMG221 or TNMM221 insert. The TNMG222 has a .031" radius, I think too big for the root of a 1-1/4-7 thread.

                          The only current insert that makes sense is a Walter Valenite TNMM221 ER-PN1 grade VP5615. It looks like this one but this one is the bigger 5/16" I.C. size.

                          http://cgi.ebay.com/8pc-TNMM-2-522ER...item4ce3bb4b41

                          If you get that style, be sure to use the compound infeed as the chip breaker design is not intended for cutting on the "back side".
                          Last edited by PixMan; 09-18-2010, 04:41 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thanks, Pix. I was using the insert shown in the pic, and I have no idea what it was, but it appeared to have a radius closer to 1/32" rather than 1/64". Your comment about compound infeed is interesting as this particular insert had no reservation about breaking once I was getting close to the final passes. That tendency had me re-thinking the idea of using inserts for deep threading on Grade 5.
                            Wayne

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The 12L14 is a dream to machine......... you threads will look almost as if they were ground. Bolts are rolled formed and not cut, most bolts anyway.
                              Hot and cold rolled don't machine very well, especially when cutting fine threads.

                              JL...................

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