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1018 vs 12L14

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  • 1018 vs 12L14

    I've been making and selling clutch pullers. A pic's worth a thousand ....



    It's time to buy some more material and I've noticed I can get the hex stock in 12L14 for significantly less than the 1018 I've been using. Whether that's a good idea or not is the subject of this post.

    I know 12L14 is leaded and supposedly machines easier, but I always thought it was some kind of exotic alloy the likes of me would never see, so I've never used it.

    In operation the threads get stressed everytime the clutch gets pulled off of a tapered crankshaft, but with the torque spec at 25 ft/lbs to install one I can't imagine it's a major amount of stress. I'm using a full inch of 1/2x28 threads which I assume should be good for thousands of cycles.

    Is there any reason I shouldn't pinch a penny and make the screw outa 12L14?

    SP

  • #2
    Hi,

    Without doing too much thinking, I think it would fine to switch. The fine threads are going to give plenty strength. And you may find that the leaded steel actually works smoother than the 1018 screw.

    Best way to find out is to make a couple with 12L14 and then use it to failure.

    dalee
    If you think you understand what is going on, you haven't been paying attention.

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    • #3
      Dalee's right. It probably will work a bit smoother since 12L14 is softer than 1018 along with a touch of Lead, hence its ease of machining capability. If all we're talking about is 25 ft/lbs., then it probably won't make much difference. Give it a good wank on a stuck clutch, and I fear the difference will rear its ugly head.
      Wayne

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      • #4
        I've found 12L14 to be to steel what Carrara is to marble: wonderful stuff to work with. It is often criticized for being rust-prone, although I haven't noticed that as a problem. 1018 threads rough, leaves little tears in the metal in my experience. Only real negative I know is leaded steel doesn't weld very good.

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        • #5
          12L14 is quite a bit stronger than 1018, the tensile strength is 60,000 psi vs 30-36,000 for 1018. McMaster-Carr rates it as poor for wear, but does not rate 1018 at all.

          Denny

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          • #6
            Normally 12L14 is more expensive than 1018, but I guess in the hex form its cheaper because of the large demand for 12L14 in that shape.

            I don't see any problem in strength and the 12L14 will machine way nicer than the garbage they sell us for 1018 steel these days.

            The only downside is the 12L14 corrodes really easily, you'll need some kind of plating on it, black oxide would be cheapest. It also doesn't weld well, but that doesn't appear to be a factor for you.

            Paul T.
            www.power-t.com

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            • #7
              Thanks for posting this pntrbl.
              I enjoy machining C12L14 almost as much as Brass but I thought it was crap as far as strength went. I knew it wouldn't weld worth a damn and yes it corrodes badly unless you protect it.

              Still learning lots from you guys.
              Mike

              My Dad always said, "If you want people to do things for you on the farm, you have to buy a machine they can sit on that does most of the work."

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              • #8
                It goes Sliced Bread, 12L14, and then its a steep drop off from there.

                Get some and try it out if for no other reason that to see how nice your threads turn out. You have a lot of engagement there, and these tools are (I'm guessing) being used by shade tree mechanics so it's not like they get torture tested every day. You should be fine.

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                • #9
                  Id think it would work well in your application as I would assume the lead would help lube the threads a little (if someone forgets to grease them as they should!)

                  It does not look like strength is a serious consern in your application, And it should be a little nicer to tap/machine.
                  Play Brutal Nature, Black Moons free to play highly realistic voxel sandbox game.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mixdenny
                    12L14 is quite a bit stronger than 1018, the tensile strength is 60,000 psi vs 30-36,000 for 1018. McMaster-Carr rates it as poor for wear, but does not rate 1018 at all.

                    Denny
                    Don't know where McMaster Carr got that spec but its wrong.

                    Heres the real spec for

                    cold drawn
                    1018 Tensile strength 85,000psi, Yield strength 70,000psi

                    12L14 Tensile strength 78,000psi, Yield strength 70,000psi.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      That looks like a nice puller design, but that's alot of machining you're doing on that threaded part.

                      Unless you have a killer lathe that knocks these out faster than I'm writing this, I'd use standard threaded rod instead, and machine the threads off the head end, then make a press fit part out of hex for the head of that end.

                      Either pin it to the rod after the press fit, or if you have a tig welder just do 2 quick fusion welds (no rod) on the end 90 degrees apart to lock it, thats around 10 seconds of welding time total.

                      You may also be able to find some "heavy duty" nuts that are tall enough just to thread on as is for the head end, again either pin them or fusion weld at the end. mcmaster.com is a good place to find nuts like that, although in quantity you would want to chase down the manufacturer to get a better price.

                      http://www.mcmaster.com/#nuts/=bb3omz

                      If you want the ends of parts to look pretty you can make a facing cut on them after the fusion welds.

                      Paul T.
                      www.power-t.com
                      PaulT
                      Senior Member
                      Last edited by PaulT; 03-05-2011, 10:16 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I make all my puller spindles out of B-7 NF all thread and a heavy hex nut.Thread the nut on the end about 1/8" below flush and fill with a MIG gun,then machine nice and pretty.
                        I also use a mix of graphite and grease for lube on the threads.

                        The 12l14 would probably be strong enough,but the tips might deform easier.
                        wierdscience
                        Senior Member
                        Last edited by wierdscience; 03-05-2011, 11:18 PM.
                        I just need one more tool,just one!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          WeirdScience, how much amp MIG welder does it take to do a reasonable job on that end filling?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Most of the puller spindles I make are either 5/8-18 or 3/4-16.

                            I will use either our Miller 210 or our little Lincoln 135 which ever is handy.

                            In the Lincoln .023 solid wire and C25 gas using the highest amp range and about 75% wire feed,makes for a poor mans spray arc.

                            In the Miller .030 solid wire,C-25 and pretty much turn and burn

                            Oh,if your machine is smaller than 130 amps,cheat and prehat the job to about 500-600*f with a torch before welding.
                            wierdscience
                            Senior Member
                            Last edited by wierdscience; 03-05-2011, 11:18 PM.
                            I just need one more tool,just one!

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