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  • wierdscience
    replied
    Originally posted by justanengineer
    Thats something I never understood. If its a 3000+ lb machine the cost is high, but for a machine you could fit in a normal mid-sized car (or even easier - small pickup) its neither expensive nor difficult to move long distance. Oil Coast = ~8 hours to the midwest = leave Friday night, stay overnight, pick it up and head back, be home Saturday night. $200 in gas + $50 for a motel....sounds like a nice cheap vacation to me.

    Ive gotten SWMBO to go along on quite a few of these weekend "vacations" and usually she even does the majority of the driving. The last one involved a stop for her at the Kentucky Derby museum in Louisville, followed by a stop at Jim Beam's distillery (which was followed by a nice nap for me thanks to "sampling" ).

    If I was looking for a small horizontal on the cheap, I would be looking at two of the best names in the business IMHO - Hardinge and Clausing. Ironically enough you were right. Ive seen quite a few sales where a hobbyist had one of these and an Atlas or Burke. The Atlas or Burke always seems to bring more, but the buyer gets significantly less IMHO.
    Well there is the time factor though.If I had the time to do all that I would just bang up some plate steel boxes,add some linear ways and be done with it.
    Then there is always the possibility of driving 800 miles round trip only to find out it's a POS.

    Yes I have seen Hardinge and Clausings and a couple others,but they don't go cheap here,even the ones GL leaves out in the rain to rust.

    Leave a comment:


  • justanengineer
    replied
    Originally posted by wierdscience
    Oh,I have,problem is there aren't any here.The ones I have seen locally were clapped out and missing parts.This means buying up north sight unseen and having it shipped in not really feasible.
    Thats something I never understood. If its a 3000+ lb machine the cost is high, but for a machine you could fit in a normal mid-sized car (or even easier - small pickup) its neither expensive nor difficult to move long distance. Oil Coast = ~8 hours to the midwest = leave Friday night, stay overnight, pick it up and head back, be home Saturday night. $200 in gas + $50 for a motel....sounds like a nice cheap vacation to me.

    Ive gotten SWMBO to go along on quite a few of these weekend "vacations" and usually she even does the majority of the driving. The last one involved a stop for her at the Kentucky Derby museum in Louisville, followed by a stop at Jim Beam's distillery (which was followed by a nice nap for me thanks to "sampling" ).

    If I was looking for a small horizontal on the cheap, I would be looking at two of the best names in the business IMHO - Hardinge and Clausing. Ironically enough you were right. Ive seen quite a few sales where a hobbyist had one of these and an Atlas or Burke. The Atlas or Burke always seems to bring more, but the buyer gets significantly less IMHO.

    Leave a comment:


  • wierdscience
    replied
    Originally posted by Rustybolt
    Might want to look at a used Barker. The larger OM model might suit your needs.
    They are made for production.
    Oh,I have,problem is there aren't any here.The ones I have seen locally were clapped out and missing parts.This means buying up north sight unseen and having it shipped in not really feasible.

    All the others,the Burkes and Atlas mills all get people frothing at the mouth at sales and go for more than the Griz mill.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rustybolt
    replied
    Originally posted by wierdscience
    After reading the review I am seriously looking at it for one reason.Every three months or so I get a job milling 1/8" key ways in some 1/2" shafts,about 300 of them at a lick.This mill and a carbide saw would be vastly better than using the B-port like I'm doing now.Plus using a 2,000lb machine to mill a 1" long key slot in a 3 ounce part is a bit ridiculous


    Might want to look at a used Barker. The larger OM model might suit your needs.
    They are made for production.

    Leave a comment:


  • saltmine
    replied
    Gad, that thing is "cute". What do you make on it, wristwatches?

    Leave a comment:


  • Arthur.Marks
    replied
    tiffie - no difference, really, for you that I see wrt spindle taper. If you like ER-32 you can just get an ER32 adapter with an R8 shank. functionally the same as your 5C>ER32 one.

    Leave a comment:


  • oldtiffie
    replied
    Originally Posted by macona

    The big problem I see is the minimum RPM is about 200. Way to fast for anything other than aluminum in horizontal mode. And there will probably be almost no power since it is just the generic PMDC motor with a SCR drive. If it was the brushless motor that they are putting on others it might fare better.
    Originally posted by aboard_epsilon
    looks like you have some room to mess about with pulleys to get the speeds you really want...pulleys look simple enough...and why is tiff moaning about buying an r8 collet set .....i see the thing as an electric power saver ..do the small jobs on this ..and not on the mamouth machines



    all the best..markj
    Mark.

    I am not "moaning" about the R8 collets and mill quill tapers at all as they work quite well for those that have and use that system.

    Many or most here in Australia use and are geared for MT3 tapers and ER-32 collets - me included - thats just the way it is.

    My ER-32 collets are used on my HF-45 mill, Sieg SX and X3 mills all of which have MT3 tapers. I use ER-32 collets on my lathe as well.

    So, fairly obviously many - mainly outside the USA (and the UK as well?) - would prefer the next/pending larger Sieg horizontl mill as it has more head-room and a greater working envelope as well as a power-head with a motor and controls similar to the X3 and SX3 vertical mills where the minimum speeds are 100 RPM with a maximum speed of 2,000 RPM (X3) and 1,750 RPM for the SX3.

    Here are the specs for the Sieg X3 mill-drill:
    https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M153

    and the Super X3 (SX3) mill:
    https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M155

    Note that both mills have MT3 tapers - as does my HF-45 mill.

    My tool and cutter grinders have C5 collets but I use John Stevenson's C5>ER-32 collet adaptor. I use ER-32 mostly and keep my C5 collets for "closer" work.

    My ER-32 adaptor for my lathe works well on my mill table as well:
    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...AirSmith03.jpg

    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...rSmith01-1.jpg

    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...c/HF45-4-1.jpg

    I use the C5>ER-32 adaptor to use my ER-32 collets on my "Spindexer":
    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a.../ER32-C5-7.jpg

    But wait - there's more:
    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...C5collets1.jpg

    http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...C5collets2.jpg

    My metric ER-32 collets each have a gripping range of 1.0mm (~0.04") and go from 2mm (~0.08") to 20mm (~0.80") and so will handle all metric and "inch" sizes in that range.

    So far as I am aware R8 collet systems do not have that versatility.

    So, I guess you could say that I am "stuck with" ("wedded to"?) ER collets and MT3 machine tapers - and works very well with the next/pending larger Sieg horizontal mill with its larger work envelope, MT3 taper and X3/SX3 type work heads.

    I only do "small" stuff and any larger stuff can be done onmy HF-45 mill-drill.

    So I am not and have no good (or any) reason to grizzle at all as I am quite prepared to wait for the newer larger Sieg MT3 taper horizontal mill as I can get by reasonably well in the meantime.

    Leave a comment:


  • J Weber
    replied
    Make a dandy dedicated screw slot cutter in my shop.Set up 3 or 4 proper sized saws and just move over to the one you need.Tad pricy for just that though.

    Leave a comment:


  • aboard_epsilon
    replied
    [quote=japcas]
    Originally posted by gwilson
    VERY serious lack of vertical space on this mill. You'd better buy a set of stub drills as the chuck takes up about 1/2 the vertical space. Plan to drill objects clamped ON THE TABLE,as there's no room for a small vise.QUOTE]


    It's not really suited for drilling anyway, without a spindle, it would be a real pain to drill using only the knee to advance the drill while in vertical mode.
    you just make a raiser block

    Leave a comment:


  • japcas
    replied
    [QUOTE=gwilson]VERY serious lack of vertical space on this mill. You'd better buy a set of stub drills as the chuck takes up about 1/2 the vertical space. Plan to drill objects clamped ON THE TABLE,as there's no room for a small vise.QUOTE]


    It's not really suited for drilling anyway, without a spindle, it would be a real pain to drill using only the knee to advance the drill while in vertical mode.

    Leave a comment:


  • wierdscience
    replied
    Originally posted by gwilson
    The thing I like the LEAST,is those dials with left over thousanths on each turn. That makes it a royal pain to move the table several inches accurately. There seem to be about 3 thousanths left over on each dial revolution.

    This is based on the SEIG machine referred to on page 2 here. I wonder if the Grizzly version has true INCH lead screws? Better check it out.
    The screws on these machines are 16tpi hince the .0625" per rev number on the dials.I have the same screws on my Seig x2 mill,they are inch and actually do work fine,although something in a 10 or 20 pitch would make decimal inch easier to hash.

    Leave a comment:


  • gwilson
    replied
    VERY serious lack of vertical space on this mill. You'd better buy a set of stub drills as the chuck takes up about 1/2 the vertical space. Plan to drill objects clamped ON THE TABLE,as there's no room for a small vise.

    The thing I like the LEAST,is those dials with left over thousanths on each turn. That makes it a royal pain to move the table several inches accurately. There seem to be about 3 thousanths left over on each dial revolution.

    If I was stuck with this mill and had the means,the first thing I'd do would be to make a set of INCH threaded leadscrews and nuts for an easier .100" per revolution. Then,new collars would have to be made as well as new nuts for the lead screws.

    Obviously,I would only do all this if I was absolutely STUCK with this mill and just a small apartment space to use it in.

    This is based on the SEIG machine referred to on page 2 here. I wonder if the Grizzly version has true INCH lead screws? Better check it out.

    At any rate,you are still stuck with the lack of vertical space,so you'd best have a drill press,and forget about accurately spaced holes,unless you have an accurate X-Y table to mount on the drill press.

    P.S.: I went to the Grizzly site,and their "detailed specs" mention nothing about the grads on the dials. By the way,I'd forget about using carbide saws on this little machine,because 1 chatter and your saw will break to pieces. Carbide needs to be run only on RIGID,heavier machines as it is so brittle.
    Last edited by gwilson; 01-05-2012, 11:02 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • wierdscience
    replied
    Originally posted by Black_Moons
    Ok, Nifty machine, But where do you get th 1/2" arbor cutters for the horzontal arbor? (or whatever it uses.. does not look big enough to take 1" arbor cutters)
    It's an R-8 spindle,so conceivably you could run 1" bore cutters on it,but that's not what it's made for.There are loads of small 2-1/2"< diameter saws and slot cutters in the catalogs that use 1/4,3/8 and 1/2" arbors.

    This machine will find a Niche as John points out.The same way the Seig X2 mills did for folks who wanted something between a Sherline and a Mill drill.

    Leave a comment:


  • aboard_epsilon
    replied
    Originally posted by macona
    The big problem I see is the minimum RPM is about 200. Way to fast for anything other than aluminum in horizontal mode. And there will probably be almost no power since it is just the generic PMDC motor with a SCR drive. If it was the brushless motor that they are putting on others it might fare better.
    looks like you have some room to mess about with pulleys to get the speeds you really want...pulleys look simple enough...and why is tiff moaning about buying an r8 collet set .....i see the thing as an electric power saver ..do the small jobs on this ..and not on the mamouth machines



    all the best..markj
    Last edited by aboard_epsilon; 01-05-2012, 08:01 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Stevenson
    replied
    I have had one for about 9 months.
    If you are looking at one of these as a main machine then unless you are doing clock or Gauge 00 trains all the while they will not suit.

    However there are niche markets in any hobby and these fill that market, like as I mentioned the clock and small electric train guys.

    Mine is setup with an angled plate type jig and is putting 20 thou wide slots into some stainless steel burner nozzles. I can leave this setup and just do the nozzles as they are called off.

    Sieg also do the tiny small C0 lathe, similar to a Unimat and this sells well with some people but they also do a CNC version.
    Then I saw this I thought it was pure novelty and not much use but this little machine outsells all the manual machines into Japan.

    Most of the Japanese users are flat based, have no room for workshops and just choose projects that fit their envelope, hence the popularity of a machine that probably will not sell outside Japan in any numbers.

    We take the CNC KX1 and KX3 machines to shows, we always get people coming up to us over the small KX1 sating it's too big, is there anything smaller.
    Same applies with the larger KX3, it's too small is there anything larger ?

    There is no one size fits all.

    Leave a comment:

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