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An exercise in old machine costing.

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  • An exercise in old machine costing.

    I have a dilemma, shortly I am getting rid of my big TOS lathe in a downsizing exercise.
    It's a big brute and not suitable for home shop use over here, in US parlance it's a 22" x 84" and so there is a limited market.

    Searching Ebay UK for similar machines of this age comes up with an average value of £500, around $760.

    This machine weighs about 2 1/2 tonne and with scrap at £175 - £180 per tonne that's £450 add to this I have a spare headstock, gearbox, apron and screw cutting box that I bought off Tim leach when he scrapped a similar lathe, so that's probably another £100

    Scrapyard will also collect.

    Plus I can keep the chucks, two 3 jaws and two 4 jaws, two faceplates, two steadies and a big Dickson quick change toolpost with about 10 - 12 holders. That lot would probably fetch £400.

    So as a working machine about £500 as scrap and bits £950

    Anyone else seeing this as no contest ?
    .

    Sir John , Earl of Bligeport & Sudspumpwater. MBE [ Motor Bike Engineer ] Nottingham England.




  • #2
    you clean it up ..and put pictures down the listing in ebay instead of in a grotty box in the corner...relaying 800 pixel ones from photobucket

    you may well get the right price .

    all the best.mark

    Comment


    • #3
      I hate to scrap a good working machine. Just think what it would cost to relace it new & what it can do. That's why I bought the Boye & Emmes 22x72 Put it on your Ebay for double scrap price as a starting price with 1 chuck. See if it sells & if so offer the buyer a fair price on the rest. I think it will sell.

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      • #4
        It`s a fact of life John.I`m scrapping immaculate power presses because I`m getting £240/tonne collected and they weigh 7-8 tonne each.
        I would struggle to get £500 selling them as there`s no demand for them now the high volume work has gone overseas.
        The other way around,a few years back I could buy non working cnc`s at 5-8 tonne weight for £5-600,now it`s £2000.
        Grit your teeth and scrap it,or waste your time with tyre kickers and non paying dreamers.Easy choice.

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        • #5
          I heartily disagree with just scrapping it.

          Yeah,, i know, and understand -"What the heck do you do with it then?"

          Store it somewere? With the economy in the dumps in many places it's sad that some small shop would be thrilled to grab this up at scrap price or better, but those small shops are slowly disappearing, and it will be some time before any manufacturing shop starts up,, IF it ever does!!

          I,ve heard this is getting to be a problem in other areas also, with larger machines. a very sad situation and a sign of our changing times.

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          • #6
            Put it on the China Ebay. If the equipment they have to work with is as bad as all the badmouthing on the forums they ought to be delighted to get a machine of this "old iron" quality. And shipping is easy. Since all of the western countries are importing way more from China than they're exporting, there ought to be tons of cargo containers going back empty to China and you could toss a crew a few pounds and a couple of cases of good English beer and the problem's solved.
            .
            "People will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time they will pick themselves up and carry on" : Winston Churchill

            Comment


            • #7
              A Tos is a good lathe. The trouble is,the larger lathes are just hard to sell. They are too big and heavy for home shop users,and many such would be afraid of trying to deal with moving the weight of that lathe.

              I'd buy it if it were close by in the USA,but I'm used to moving heavy machinery,and I have room for it.

              Hopefully you will be able to sell it. But,probably it will best be sold to a professional machine shop.(Unless they ALL have gone CNC.) There are smaller job shops that still have need of manual lathes.

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              • #8
                I'm not so sure about that.

                Some "small shops" will want it for virtually nil. If that is at or close to the market rate - why bother - its not only pretty well giving it away but any effort etc. that you put in (if costed at a realistic hourly rate) means that you are almost standing a net loss and virtually paying him to take it away.

                Machines and tools are only commodities are are scrap and iron ore.

                You either keep it and either use it or clutter up your shop with little or no room for more or you just write it down to zero or for whatever the scrapper will give you. It will only be a phone call to the scrapper and it might all be gone in a day or so with minimum effort and disruption and either at no cost or perhaps a small profit.

                Why would you - or should I? - do it any other way?

                I don't see that others opinions should matter in what is a personal and business matter on how anyone else disposes of tools etc.

                Some seem to think that they have a "moral right" to at least first option/refusal and that I or anyone else should be under a moral right to give them that right or privelege.

                No way.

                There will never be a "car boot" or "garage" sale here either for pretty much the same reasons.

                Comment


                • #9
                  machinery dealers around here report selling big manual lathes to india....and they have to compete with scrap prices on everything they buy....no idea what your market is like but might be worth some calls
                  in Toronto Ontario - where are you?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Personally, I would not scrap a machine that is working. Once these machines go to scrap, they are gone.

                    If I scrap a machine,
                    1) I will never see it again.
                    2) It will no longer do any work.
                    3) General capacity for the area drops, jobs go to another area.


                    If I sell a machine,
                    1) I make a contact.
                    2) I can send work to the machine if needed (depending).
                    3) Just maybe I put another guy to work.

                    If needed, sell it to another user at scrap rate. Tell them up front it is for sale at scrap rate. Back down to the ebay price if needed. Add the additional parts as it suits you.

                    Also, around here, the ebay price is not necessarily the going rate. If someone tells me a price and note that it is based on ebay sales, I tell them to go sell it on ebay. There are all sorts of extra costs for selling things on ebay. Not to mention the skill needed to post the sale, field the questions, meet the visitors wanting to see the item etc. There is extra cost and I try to keep it in mind.

                    rock~
                    Civil engineers build targets, Mechanical engineers build weapons.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      EBay those major size extras until it comes exactly time to scrap the complete machine, if they sell great, if not scrap as well. Keep the other bits you listed, minimize hassle.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by sasquatch
                        Tiffie, you have a VERY negative attitude towards just about anything,,, in my opinion!!
                        It's just a machine. And not a particularly desirable or valuable one either judging by actual prices paid under current market conditions.

                        If you have the time and energy, parting it out may bring the best return on sale. No time or energy to do that, the breakers it is. There is no reason to attach sentiment to a machine. You can get them anywhere, anytime.

                        dalee
                        If you think you understand what is going on, you haven't been paying attention.

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                        • #13
                          Same way here, I just have to beat the scapper to it. It's a shame too. These tools made our country great & now if it's too big for a small garage or not CNC no one wants it. Like killing the watchdog cause he's old. No regard for the fine job he's done.
                          Why not find a useful place for it like a railroad club. I bet if you advertised someone needs it for cash, trade or donation (you'll be their hero) just don't scap it. What would it cost new now if you bought one of that quality? Hell I'll buy it as long as you'll deliver it free.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Look at what a TOS goes for in the US on Ebay. A 16x60 is $9950/obo. & they go much higher. I don't know the condition of yours nut the $9950 didn't look great.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Sentiment be hanged.......

                              A machine is a means of livelihood for someone. Maybe not you, but someone. Buying it may be just what they need to do. I know a couple companies here that need such a machine.... but are not going to buy new, at least not yet.

                              At some point, the lack of machinery like that will be a negative influence on the general economy. So selling instead of deciding up front that "nobody would buy it anyhow" has at least a societal benefit.

                              So, there are decent overall economic reasons for selling, if it is saleable. It may not produce the absolute maximum last penny of profit for you, but.... it depends on if you NEED that last penny worse than the next guy. Obviously if it is NOT saleable, then the discussion is over.

                              so.....

                              You can straight up say "Everyone else can go stuff it, I am gonna get MINE", and go for the absolute maximum money return to you, regardless. Just like Mitt Romney, Andy Redleaf, and the rest of those 1% types.

                              Nothing *illegal* about that. It's yours, you can do whatever.

                              Or you can give it a shot at a sale first, and if no takers after an honest attempt, proceed on your way to maximize return from the bones.
                              1601

                              Keep eye on ball.
                              Hashim Khan

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