Bilz tapping collets - how to?

[John Stevenson]

Neat bit of gear Tim, means I now have to get my finger out.

[Timleech]

John

I decided to follow up your idea about an MT holder, thought I would strike while the iron was hot (or at least while it was on my mind).
I'd forgotten until sorting through the Bilz collets that I had this holder, came as part of a job lot but it had a 32mm shank which was no bl**dy use to ordinary mortals:-



To make it more useful it needed a smaller shank, but first had to be dismantled so that I could hold it properly:-



It was a bit of a mess inside, with rusted springs etc. Cleaned it all up, found a couple of new springs which were somewhere near right. Then turned down the shank to MT2 taper, to fit in a sleeve:-



The shank was hard, but not too hard for a carbide insert. I couldn't go much smaller because of the internal bore. Then Loctited the shank into an MT2-3 sleeve.

Finally reassembly, that was a bit of a challenge. One unexpected issue was that it has six balls inside, three for the collet lock and three to take the drive torque. They all looked the same, but three were 4.95mm & the other three 5.15mm. It doesn't work if you put them in the wrong places!

Finished product:-



With all the messing about, took a good chunk of the afternoon which was not in the plan!

Tim

[John Stevenson]

That wasn't a whine, that was a bitch

Seriously I don't mind, I can't get them made and market them, chances are total sales over a year are sub 20 any way.

The Allendale / machine DRO lads are OK, we stand the same shows and get on well. When I wanted a new DRO for the Bridgy a while ago they really did me a good deal, they gave me trade without asking for it and even upgraded to a better display, again without asking.

[Black Forest]

I sure hope you have some good cheese to go with that whine Sir John!

[John Stevenson]

Bastard.
Talking to them at a show and told him what I'd done, anyway good luck to them, they have the ability to get things done but royalties would have been nice

Even copied the JT6 taper when they could have used anything. Any patent lawyers here ?

[Timleech]

Yes Tim, Allendale.
I bought the air tapping head and a full set of chucks, M3 to M12 for £320 a while ago and made my own frame.
Knowing what I know now I should have bougt one years ago but until these Chinese ones came on the market they were very expensive here.
even second hand they were fetching £1200 to £1500 at auction.

I have made on 'chuck' which is just a dogged drive to fit the motor with a JT6 taper and 13mm keyless chuck. handy for holding a countersink to remove the burrs from tapping. Wobbles about a bit for accurate drilling and is a slow speed but fine for the odd hole or countersink / counterbore.

Like this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Type-1-Tap-Collet-with-Jacobs-JT6-Chuck-Adaptor-Tapping-/230848691706

?

Tim

[John Stevenson]

Yes Tim, Allendale.
I bought the air tapping head and a full set of chucks, M3 to M12 for £320 a while ago and made my own frame.
Knowing what I know now I should have bougt one years ago but until these Chinese ones came on the market they were very expensive here.
even second hand they were fetching £1200 to £1500 at auction.

I have made on 'chuck' which is just a dogged drive to fit the motor with a JT6 taper and 13mm keyless chuck. handy for holding a countersink to remove the burrs from tapping. Wobbles about a bit for accurate drilling and is a slow speed but fine for the odd hole or countersink / counterbore.

[John Stevenson]

Jerry,
thanks for that link, some good spec sheets on there.
Looks like mine are the #1 series chucks.

[Timleech]

Tim,
How much ?

I had to buy an extra one for my set as there are two standards for shank diameter and if I remember right it's the 10mm one that gave the problem.
Can't remember what I paid £35, seems to ring a bell ? but I got them from the Machine DRO lads

Sorry got no spares, just enough for the range I do M3 to M12

Oops, sorry John. Just spotted one of the M10 is for the skinny taps with 7mm shank, so no duplicate.
Gloster Tooling have (Chinese?) ones on ebay for 29 quid, they're 40 quid from Allendale (is that Machine-dro?) name brand seem to be that sort of money secondhand. I know I didn't pay anywhere near that for mine, but it was a few years ago when there were still bargains to be found on fleabay.

Tim

[macona]

If you dont mind shipping, Tools-n-gizmos has a pretty good selection of Bilz collets at good prices:

http://www.tools-n-gizmos.com/store/agora.cgi?user2=yes&user4=CollQCTap,Bilz&titttle=Bilz-Type_Quick-Change_Tap_Adapters_for_sale&ppinc=MT

-Jerry

[John Stevenson]

Tim,
How much ?

I had to buy an extra one for my set as there are two standards for shank diameter and if I remember right it's the 10mm one that gave the problem.
Can't remember what I paid £35, seems to ring a bell ? but I got them from the Machine DRO lads

Sorry got no spares, just enough for the range I do M3 to M12

[Timleech]

Tim,
One of my to do jobs [ think it's number 37.487 on the list ] is to make a MT4 arbor with two driving lugs to take these collets so I can tap on the lathe and not have to worry about hitting the bottom of a hole.

They are brilliant, been doing some deep M3 blind holes today into alloy, just keep going until it slips then reverse. 48 holes in about 10 minutes and not a worry.

That's given me an idea, thanks.

Just checking through the collets that I have, there are two at M10. I'd be happy to swap one of those for another size, similar style, with someone in the UK. I have M5 to M12 and 1/4", M4 or M3 would be handy. I've just seen the price of new ones!!

Tim

[John Stevenson]

Tim,
One of my to do jobs [ think it's number 37.487 on the list ] is to make a MT4 arbor with two driving lugs to take these collets so I can tap on the lathe and not have to worry about hitting the bottom of a hole.

They are brilliant, been doing some deep M3 blind holes today into alloy, just keep going until it slips then reverse. 48 holes in about 10 minutes and not a worry.

[Timleech]

Tim,

You keep tightening it until the tap snaps in an otherwise finished piece of work, then you back it off half a turn

Ian

That's what I was afraid of!

I actually stripped one down, then put it together with a fairly modest pressure, & upped the pressure a couple of times until it would do the job (M10 blind holes in cast iron)

Tim

[Jaakko Fagerlund]

Thanks John.
So, how do you determine the correct setting?

Tim

Can't say how you would adjust the type pictured, but the usual tapping heads that have the adjusting ring on the outside, you just tighten it until it starts cutting with a new tap.