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  • spoons

    Hello. Ran across this forum by accident and would like to ask a question if you don't mind. This is my last chance I think for this idea to work. I have been interested/ involved in knife making in a small way for a while, and in wood working in a larger way for a long while. I recently got the bug to build myself a complete set of dinerware from scratch. I would like to use thin 440C and stabalized wood to hand craft each piece. What I can not figure out is how to shape a spoon. Can a set of dies/ molds be made out of thick steel so I van use a press to form hot steel into spoon shape? Forks I can do by hand, but I need two sets of dies for teaspoon and tablespoon. Can it be done for an affordable price? If I have broken some rule or put this in the wrong place feel free to delete it. If not, TIA for any advice, pro or con.

  • #2
    Wow, this is going to be one expensive tableware set.

    I'm not sure you would want to use 440. I don't think it holds up well in the acids and salts found in food. One of the austenitic stainless steels may be a better choice.

    Yep, you could form the spoons using dies and a press. These would be your biggest expense. I think you could get by with cold forming also. No need to add forging to the expense.

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    • #3
      You can make the dies out of D-2 or S-7 and then harden it and they should last forever with even a 500Ton press (not that you would need one). 303 or 316 Stainless would be a better choice in stainless Steels. 440C is hardenable and difficult to work - not that the 3xx series are easy to work either...

      You might want to look at making them out of Gold or Silver - this metal can be hand beaten with hammers and hand tools and easliy worked with MAPP gas torches. I suggest that you get youself a book on Silversmithing and proceed form there - it is a rewarding pastime and can be lucrative if you are adept and artistic. If you do a good job you will leave a family heirloom of great value.

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      • #4
        Perhaps hand beaten silver would be a better choice. The old fashioned way. If you are going to go to that much effort why not use silver?

        Whuups, I didn't finish reading all of Thrud's post. Great minds think alike

        [This message has been edited by Evan (edited 03-18-2004).]
        Free software for calculating bolt circles and similar: Click Here

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        • #5
          If you heat gold too hot doesn't it more melt than become easier to form?

          At least that us what my science teacher says.
          Does anyone actually read siglines?

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          • #6
            I would like to ask a couple of questions about this also.

            Could this be done with one set of dies to both shear the blank and form the bowl & bend the handle or would you need 2 sets?
            What size press would be needed to do this? Could it be done on a hand operated arbor press or a H frame bottle jack hydraulic press?

            ------------------
            Jesse
            Jesse

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            • #7
              First, thanks for all the replys! I think for as large a setting as I want to make silver would be pretty expensie, won't even comment on gold.I am grateful fior the advice on steel however. Will make a note of that.J Ts post might clarify what I was thinking as he stated it better. Two piece die that I could sandwich hot steel between and press in an automotive type press,12-20 ton. What I really need to know I guess can dies be made and how much they would cost.

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              • #8
                Imokie

                If you wanted to you could electroplate the set with gold or silver.
                One other thing I would like to ask is if it could be done without heating the stock? How much more force would it take?

                ------------------
                Jesse

                [This message has been edited by J Thornton (edited 03-18-2004).]
                Jesse

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                • #9
                  Let's do some figuring here, in round numbers, of course.

                  SS in 16ga or slightly thicker takes roughly 2 tons per inch to shear. A teaspoon is 6"+ length. So the perimeter would be 14"+/-. That would take a 28 ton press capacity. Presses should never be run close to their rated capacity, let's specify a minimum of a 50 ton press. That tonnage would only do the blanking of the shape out of sheet material. Forming, coining, etc would be on top of that, now we may well be up to a 100 ton or more press.

                  As to the dies, since you asked I assume you don't have the equipment/knowledge to make these yourself. Maybe $10K+ to have a compound die made for shearing and forming, etc on a teaspoon.

                  Convinced this may not be a viable project yet?


                  May I suggest an alternate approach? Buy some of the el cheapo restaurant flatware, similar to what you see at a Denny's restaurant. Embellish the cheap stuff with your own designs and thin the edges as appropriate.



                  [This message has been edited by DR (edited 03-18-2004).]

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                  • #10
                    That's what I had heard, but wanted to find out for sure from people that actually know. As far as shear, my plan was to cut out the shape on a band saw.Shape to be determined bu trial and error. Only need a die to form the actual cupped part of the spoon.The more hand work I have to do the better.
                    Yes, I had thought about buying pre-made flatware and building handles for them. Seems my only option.
                    Thanks again, Carl.

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                    • #11
                      You might also want to look at this guy's page www.heritagesonline.homestead.com/metalworking2.html

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                      • #12
                        Thanks DR
                        That does put my SS spork idea on the back burner for a couple of years.

                        ------------------
                        Jesse
                        Jesse

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                        • #13
                          You could shape the bowl of the spoon by hammering it into a small pipe. Soom blacksmiths have a castiron block with cavities that would be better.Use the ball end of a ballpein hammer. Try making soom out of mild steel before to practice first.

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                          • #14
                            Imokie

                            It is impracticalfor you to consider doing this with anything less than a 500 ton prss brake. This is a coining operation, and although commercial cuttlery is manufactueed in toggle presses they are often 150 ton units and it is a multi step process well beyond the scope of the average metalhead.

                            Your comment about siver being too expensive is wrong however, as silver is only about $7 per ounce and you could do one piece at a time and thus not tie up huge amounts of money, thus doing your hobby in the Pay as you go catagory - not all that bad!

                            In actual fact you would find that the Stainless Steel stock would be far more expensive for the flat stock that you would need to buy than the silver sheet. So your assumption are ill founded. Just because you can buy stanless flat ware in wally world for half a buck does not mean you can buy the material for that price - that is the irony of the situation...

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                            • #15
                              I'd try beating the shape cold over a spoon shaped dolly...

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