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Wiring for Millrite 3-phase retrofit

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  • Wiring for Millrite 3-phase retrofit

    The single-phase motor on my Millrite knee mill burned out so I got a replacement from DC Morrison. It's 3-phase, so I got a phase converter and now I have to figure out how to wire it. I don't understand 3-phase electricity, I'm hoping somebody here does and can make sense out of these pix. This diagram came with the converter:



    Here's the switch from the old motor and the diagrams that were on the inside of its cover:



    And here's the wires coming out of the motor. The wires were twisted together in groups and I drew the diagram to show how they're arranged:

    Last edited by Commander_Chaos; 10-07-2013, 10:11 PM.

  • #2
    Come in from the cobwebs and get an VFD.
    "But I dowanna deal with Bla bla blah.."
    No really, you want a VFD.

    Cheaper and better, way better.

    But you are asking how to wire a reversing switch,
    so I suspect you will be afraid of a VFD.

    --Doozer
    DZER

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Doozer View Post
      Come in from the cobwebs and get an VFD.
      "But I dowanna deal with Bla bla blah.."
      No really, you want a VFD.

      Cheaper and better, way better.

      But you are asking how to wire a reversing switch,
      so I suspect you will be afraid of a VFD.

      --Doozer
      WTF is a VFD?

      Comment


      • #4
        http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/...z-_230_VAC%29#

        See the link.

        --Doozer
        DZER

        Comment


        • #5
          Second a VFD. With a static phase converter like what you intend to use you will loose a lot of the power of the motor and they dont run as smooth.

          Comment


          • #6
            lol ... go with the VFD ... it may limit the potential power of the 3 phase motor .. but ..
            its benefits way out weigh that. Just hook up your 220 to the VFD and hook the 3
            outputs to the three wires coming from your motor and your done. What goes where
            you ask ? Doesn't matter .. cool huh. If the motor goes the wrong way .. just reverse
            any two wires. Then you have direction AND speed control. Way easier than you would
            think.

            Mike
            John Titor, when are you.

            Comment


            • #7
              You get full nameplate power with a VFD. I dont know where this myth that you use power with a vfd keeps coming from.

              No need to reverse wires with a vfd. A parameter sets that.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by macona View Post
                Second a VFD. With a static phase converter like what you intend to use you will loose a lot of the power of the motor and they dont run as smooth.
                Third...

                Also.... if you don't limit the power you pull from a static converter connected motor, you will burn it out.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Macona .. oops .. your right about the power, I had static on my mind in that sentence.
                  And the reverse any two wires statement was to show the un-importance of the
                  initial wiring (from the VFD to the motor) .. and still stands.

                  Mike
                  John Titor, when are you.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    So I guess a VFD takes the place of the old switch? Does it do the job of the phase converter as well? Really looking for basic information here.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      the phase converter is not hard to wire to a machine with a 3 phase motor, but going from single to 3 phase will take some knowledge as far as the F/R switch...so yes the VFD takes the place of the switch and phase converter, you wire the motor directly to the VFD out put terminals. And as others have said its a true 3 phase that will make your motor much happier, it will run much smother, and you can control the speed.....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by metalmole View Post
                        the phase converter is not hard to wire to a machine with a 3 phase motor, but going from single to 3 phase will take some knowledge as far as the F/R switch...so yes the VFD takes the place of the switch and phase converter, you wire the motor directly to the VFD out put terminals. And as others have said its a true 3 phase that will make your motor much happier, it will run much smother, and you can control the speed.....
                        Does that mean the VFD doesn't do forward/reverse? Clearly several of you know how to do this but are unclear on what I know. Here's a diagram that shows the gap in my knowledge. It's represented by "B":

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Commander, What you need in 'B' is a VFD (Variable Frequency Drive)
                          As others have said, it does everything you need.
                          It 'converts' 240 volt, single phase power into 240 volt, 3-phase power (Which your motor needs).
                          It ALSO controls motor speed with a handy knob, AND reverses motor direction with the press of a button (FWD/REV).
                          They're easy to install. Two wires in (240v single phase), and three wires out to your motor (240v 3-phase).
                          You WILL need a kill switch, or on/off switch BETWEEN 'A' (Power source) and 'B' (VFD) in order to turn off the VFD at night.
                          It doesn't have an on/off switch. It's basically 'on' all the time.
                          So your actual setup would be:
                          'A' Power ---- 'B' Kill switch ---- 'C' VFD ------ 'D' Mill motor
                          The VFD is now your 'new' on/off, fwd/rev switch, and speed control. No need for the old switch since it's been bypassed.
                          That's all there is to it.
                          You'll love it.
                          However, you'll probably need to make some sort of mount or arm to hang the VFD onto. Or mount it to the wall if it's in reach.
                          Here's what my VFD looks like:
                          Last edited by KiddZimaHater; 10-08-2013, 11:28 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If you wish to use the static phase converter you diagrammed in your initial post while puzzling out VFDs, then the motor leads you pictured appear to be set up correctly for 220 V operation.
                            T4/T5/T6 are insulated and only connected to each other. The T1/T7, T2/T8 and T3/T9 are connected to L1, L2 and T3 on the static converter. Use the connex diagram on the switch
                            designated for 3 phase motors and it will operate as off center, Forward and Reverse on switching. The static converters must be matched to your motor size and reduce maximum motor
                            power by about 1/3. Commercial static converters, new, cost about the same as a VFD or AC motor drive. VFD is an electronic device that takes mains power and converts it to 3ph AC
                            power at 220v (or higher depending) at a variable frequency. Typical useful frequency range is 10 herz to 100 herz, but they will output down to near 0 herz and upto 400hz. Speciallized
                            motors are needed to be useful above ~100 hz or so. Low power VFD (say 1 hp) that work on 110VAC are available, but 220Vac input is better. VFD are available well into the megawatt
                            range, but HSM look at <5HP mostly. There are two general types, simple VFD do not compensate for motor power loss as the Hz go down, more complex VFD have compensatory circuitry
                            that does compensate ("sensorless" "vector" etc refer to the compensating kind). Compensating VFD are $50-100 more than noncompensating VFD. Google VFD for sources. Be aware
                            that the manuals for these things are less intuitive than the healthcare.gov site and cover things you don't want to know about. You will have to read the manual 5x before it begins to sink in.
                            Manuals can be downloaded.

                            Finally all VFD are ALL east asian sourced, but name brands are to be preferred. Ebay is chock full of Chinese cheapos of variable provenance and no warranty supplied. Sudden death is more
                            common with these. factorymation, dealerselectric, automationdirect, vfds.com are better sources for name brand robust vfds. Their prices are very low for what you are getting.
                            Last edited by sch; 10-08-2013, 11:36 AM.
                            Steve

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                            • #15
                              Thanks guys, that cleared up plenty.

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