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Should I worry about 460 volt machines?

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  • Should I worry about 460 volt machines?

    Friend will sell me a gear head drill, runs on 460v, I only have 220, so for slightly more he'll throw in a step-up transformer after he removes it from the machine onto which it is now bolted. Never had 460v. before, so tell me if there are any special challenges, or everyone does it and no sweat.

  • #2
    No problem with a transformer. I don't know why but most radial drills I've seen are 460-480V & not convertable like most 3phase machines. The Swiss one I got with the machine shop is but it's the only one I've seen.
    "Let me recommend the best medicine in the
    world: a long journey, at a mild season, through a pleasant
    country, in easy stages."
    ~ James Madison

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    • #3
      My BIL has a K&T 2D on 460 volts through a step up transformer. No problems or special issues with it...

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      • #4
        The 480 is still in the UL voltage range, which is up to 600V. Insulated wire for 600V is commonly available.

        It DOES involve you in connectors which can be significantly more expensive, especially if at higher currents, so hard wiring with disconnect may be better.

        Above that is "medium voltage", which is not so nice..... Motors running on 4160V? Not preferred in my shop, thanks.....
        1601

        Keep eye on ball.
        Hashim Khan

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        • #5
          Also make sure any fuses or circuit breakers on the 460V line are properly rated. Usually 600V, but some are 500V. Don't use the more common 300V rated protection devices or switches. You may be able to hard wire from the 460V secondary of the autotransformer and use fuses and switches on the 230V primary side. This should be OK if the autotransformer is located close to the machine and proper wiring is used to the motor. Armored cable might be a good idea, but make sure the cut ends are properly terminated to keep ground continuity and protect the wires inside.
          http://pauleschoen.com/pix/PM08_P76_P54.png

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          P S Technology, Inc. www.pstech-inc.com
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          • #6
            Fuse the primary at 125% of the primary current rating ((KVA/831)*1.25) or fuse the primary up to 300% of the primary current and fuse the secondary at 125% secondary current.
            The latter is more reliable but the first is likely all you will need for a machine tool.
            If its an auto transformer (likely) no provinsions for grounding the secondary are required as you will have a reference through the tranny.
            Other than that there s nothing to worry about, 480/277 is the standard industrial voltage int he US, in Canada its 600/347.
            Cheers,
            Jon

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Cannonmn View Post
              Friend will sell me a gear head drill, runs on 460v, I only have 220, so for slightly more he'll throw in a step-up transformer after he removes it from the machine onto which it is now bolted. Never had 460v. before, so tell me if there are any special challenges, or everyone does it and no sweat.
              Do you have 3ph on the wall?

              Going 220 1ph, to 440V 3ph takes "extra equipment".

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              • #8
                Originally posted by CalM View Post
                Do you have 3ph on the wall?

                Going 220 1ph, to 440V 3ph takes "extra equipment".
                Thanks, yes have 220 3ph on the wall, is an industrial-type building. Have a friend who hooks up the machines, he doesn't like plugs etc. so everything gets hard-wired to the wall off a breaker in the main panel with appropriate rating.

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                • #9
                  Then it is only a matter of a suitable transformer

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                  • #10
                    my Feeler HLV copy lathe is 440 3 Phase, I have a rotary making 3 phase 220, then I use a step down transformer backwards to power the lathe. Works great and the wires (factory on the lathe) are tiny!

                    Go for it, 440 stuff is cheap cause home guys are scared of it.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Cannonmn View Post
                      Friend will sell me a gear head drill, runs on 460v, I only have 220, so for slightly more he'll throw in a step-up transformer after he removes it from the machine onto which it is now bolted. Never had 460v. before, so tell me if there are any special challenges, or everyone does it and no sweat.
                      Do you have 208 or 240 3 phase? 220 would be odd ball unless you have buck/boost transformers in line. Most common is 208 (wye). If that the case you just need 208-> 480 transformer. or.. Change the motor. Don't worry about the "460" verses "480". 460 is the motor design criteria so it can develop full power with an assumed voltage drop on input.

                      Take great care with 480. You can die. If you have no real experience, get an electrician to wire it for you.

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                      • #12
                        Thanks, yes, cheap, Swedish-made large bench model, works fine, $350 incl transformer. Think it takes M3 drills. Speed adjusts from very slow to 1000 rpm. Yes I think our voltage is actually 208. I think we'll attach the transformer box to the drill to eliminate need for 440v wires around the shop.
                        Last edited by Cannonmn; 11-29-2016, 12:09 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by hitnmiss View Post
                          I have a rotary making 3 phase 220, then I use a step down transformer backwards to power the lathe. Works great
                          I did the same thing for a Kasto power hacksaw, it was easier than finding a suitable 2-speed replacement motor.

                          ME
                          Last edited by Michael Edwards; 11-29-2016, 12:20 PM. Reason: spelling

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                          • #14
                            Lots of years ago when I was at Purdue University taking my Bachelors degree I had a professor in an electrical machines class that had helped several States design their electric chairs. Back then it was the preferred method of execution.
                            He stated that 110/115 Volts AC was just about the lowest voltage that wold kill an adult human under ideal conditions.
                            440 is well above that threshold.
                            You should insure all of the wiring meets code. If you don't know how then hire a professional electrician.
                            I have been shocked by 440 and I was out for about 5 minutes.
                            Fortunately it was not under ideal conditions to induce current flow through my heart so I survived without ill effects. I do have a scar on my arm to this day.
                            Bill
                            I cut it off twice and it's still too short!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by lakeside53 View Post
                              Do you have 208 or 240 3 phase? 220 would be odd ball unless you have buck/boost transformers in line. Most common is 208 (wye). If that the case you just need 208-> 480 transformer. or.. Change the motor. Don't worry about the "460" verses "480". 460 is the motor design criteria so it can develop full power with an assumed voltage drop on input.

                              Take great care with 480. You can die. If you have no real experience, get an electrician to wire it for you.
                              It would be nice if people would use the proper values for describing voltages. Electric utilities use 120 volts as a base voltage reference when it comes to setting and adjusting the voltage output of substation transformers, not 110V, not 117V.

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