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  • Coolant on T&C/surface grinder?

    Most of what I see and read about surface grinders seems to say that running coolant is really helpful, and in some operations key, for good outcomes with the SG.

    I have a pretty nicely equipped KO Lee T&C Grinder. The manual indicates that it can be used for limited light duty surface grinding, and I have a small mag chuck that is about the right size for the machine. The machine is not really set up well for running flood coolant and I'm not sure I'd be doing this frequently enough to warrant setting up and maintaining it anyhow.

    I clearly see how flood cooling would be an advantage for a grinding operation. Question is: is a mister or "zero-fog" type cooler of any use for this sort of work? Does misting provide sufficient cooling to make it worth using on a surface grinding type operation? Obviously if it was the ideal method every grinding shop would be doing it this way, so I know it is less than optimal. I guess the question is if it would be even worth the bother of using.

    Thoughts?

  • #2
    Running a "no coolant" machine grinding full or partial surface hardening may cause surface micro cracks which is to be avoided - for fairly obvious reasons in some cases.

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    • #3
      dry surface grinding is fine, although wet is better. You will get a better finish with wet. Wet also contributes to accuracy in that the temperature of the work, and hence size, stays roughly the same. Where your grinder can really shine is as a light duty cylindrical grinder - for that you need flood. Main reason is temp control to stop the work from growing. Just saying if you went to the trouble of adding it, it might have other advantages although hear is of less of an issue surface grinding as the mag chuck has mass and draws it off.

      What model? I've a Chevalier knock off I added flood to....minimal mods and its nice to have
      .

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      • #4
        I have a KO T&C grinder also. It's not really designed to be used as a SG. The column does not have the stability or accuracy for the down feed. It'll be hit and miss and you won't be able to control the down feed in tenths.

        On the coolant... Neither of my machines are set up for coolant. I get good results without, you just have to go a little slower and be careful not to let things get too warm. Keep in mind I said warm and not hot.

        I have used a mister. It works almost as well as flood coolant with a lot less mess. I also have a cold air gun that works well as far as keeping things cool but it also blows the dust around which is something I like to avoid. So I would say go with the mister. It's easy to control the flow, you won't flood everything and you can put some paper towels around the chuck to soak up any excess runoff.

        JL............
        Last edited by JoeLee; 06-18-2017, 09:20 AM.

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        • #5
          Absolutely essential

          Does not take a lot of volume of coolant being it is mixed with air and sprayed under the wheel. This helps the wheel from becoming too wet and possibly out of balance. It also helps prevent the wheel from becoming loaded up with grit and burning the work rather then shearing off metal.

          It also allows you to grind aluminum using a coarse open stone and plenty of coolant to keep the particles flowing out of the stone.

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          • #6
            I have a Kent Automatic Surface Grinder as well as a Cincinnati #2 T&C Grinder fully tooled.

            On the Surface Grinder I wouldn't think of using it without the coolant on. The coolant is mixed with air and sprayed under the wheel but it is definitely heavier then a mist coolant. It allows several things as mentioned above as the work not over heating and expanding, the wheel not becoming loaded with particles and staying sharp and shearing the work.

            As for the T&C Grinder I never have thought of using coolant as they are designed for taking very light short duration cuts, with very narrow / shaped wheels. They are not designed in any way for serious metal removal.

            Had a chance to purchase (and kick myself to this day for not) a Cincinnati Universal Cylindrical Grinder. With a footprint of 4' x 8' and 6000lbs I just couldn't accommodate it

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            • #7
              Originally posted by JoeFin View Post

              On the Surface Grinder I wouldn't think of using it without the coolant on. The coolant is mixed with air and sprayed under the wheel but it is definitely heavier then a mist coolant. It allows several things as mentioned above as the work not over heating and expanding, the wheel not becoming loaded with particles and staying sharp and shearing the work.

              As for the T&C Grinder I never have thought of using coolant as they are designed for taking very light short duration cuts, with very narrow / shaped wheels. They are not designed in any way for serious metal removal.

              Had a chance to purchase (and kick myself to this day for not) a Cincinnati Universal Cylindrical Grinder. With a footprint of 4' x 8' and 6000lbs I just couldn't accommodate it
              I agree with all the advantages you cite, but I'll disagree that its essential in that you can work without it....but i'm with you, it is worth the hassle and I run flood on the surface grinder almost always.

              On the T&CG, I've got flood on one which I put on for cylindrical grinding, where I do think its close to essential. I have a diy mist system on the small t&CG - it is very handy as it keeps endmills, drills etc cool so you get a lot more done in a shorter time. I made the mister with pressurized air and coolant, separate controls, so you can tun it such that you don't get a fog
              Last edited by Mcgyver; 06-18-2017, 12:14 PM.
              .

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              • #8
                Coolant on a surface grinder is absolutely NOT essential.
                If you are practiced in proper grinding techniques, you don't
                need it. Coolant is for production or those who don't know
                how to control the variables associated with proper grinding.

                -D
                DZER

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                • #9
                  Thanks for chiming in, guys.

                  It is a KO Lee B860, not one of their more common models, but I got a gloat-worthy deal on it as it was in great shape and came with a load of accessories. I have only barely touched on the range of things this can do, but I really like using the thing.

                  I have a couple of motorized spindle fixtures and have done a small bit of light cylindrical grinding with it, mostly just fooling around to try it. I was amazed at how easy it was to dial in to the point that I could make a small rod measure the same diameter within a tenth over a couple of inches. Surface finish was not superb, but it was decent and the size was dead on. Not bad for someone who really had only the vaguest idea what they were doing. I impressed myself, anyhow.

                  I know machines like this are not ideal for surface grinding. A real surface grinder would be nice, but I don't really have the room nor the ongoing need for one. I have not really attempted this on this machine. This came to mind as I was thinking of grinding a couple of small parts I am working on, mostly so they will be "reasonably" flat and with a nice finish. And just to see how it goes. Sounds like I can at least try out the mister and see how it goes. Fitting up for flood coolant may be a bit more involved but I suppose anything is doable.

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                  • #10
                    As a general case, tool and cutter grinders often either do not have coolant used or fitted - that is to say not always - as in many T&C grinder operations the wheel is both open and dry and in some operations no really effect wheel guard is or can be fitted either.

                    Surface and cylindrical grinders are another matter - mostly - as guards and coolant are fitted.

                    But many combination T&C and surface and cylindrical grinding tasks can be carried out quite effectively.

                    https://www.machines4u.com.au/view/a...TM-6025/62861/

                    In the general case I use well-dressed course wheels and just use well-dressed finer wheels if necessary for "finer" or "better" grinding but in many cases "grinding" is not necessary or required if the "job finish" from a lathe or mill will suffice.

                    I go for "finish" that is both "adequate" and "functional".
                    Last edited by oldtiffie; 06-18-2017, 10:55 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by alanganes View Post
                      Question is: is a mister or "zero-fog" type cooler of any use for this sort of work?
                      Quick answer. No. One is for cooling one is for lubrication. JR
                      My old yahoo group. Bridgeport Mill Group

                      https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...port_mill/info

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by JoeLee View Post
                        I have a KO T&C grinder also. It's not really designed to be used as a SG. The column does not have the stability or accuracy for the down feed. It'll be hit and miss and you won't be able to control the down feed in tenths.

                        On the coolant... Neither of my machines are set up for coolant. I get good results without, you just have to go a little slower and be careful not to let things get too warm. Keep in mind I said warm and not hot.

                        I have used a mister. It works almost as well as flood coolant with a lot less mess. I also have a cold air gun that works well as far as keeping things cool but it also blows the dust around which is something I like to avoid. So I would say go with the mister. It's easy to control the flow, you won't flood everything and you can put some paper towels around the chuck to soak up any excess runoff.

                        JL............
                        Use a good dial indicator under or over the grinding head and raise and then lower the grinding head and it will be just fine.

                        For the "final" cut, dress the wheel and take "spring" cuts to "finish off".
                        Last edited by oldtiffie; 06-18-2017, 11:48 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Now I would like to add. That KO grinder is built to eat. When it does, if there was no coolant flow you might be breathing heavy metal. Cause thats what we grind right, dense metal. But do not think a drip system will replace or come close to being a coolant. Compressed air and all. No Bueno. JR
                          My old yahoo group. Bridgeport Mill Group

                          https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...port_mill/info

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Wear correct facial filters.

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