OT: My Well Traveled 3D Printer

[wierdscience]

Geez,how can USPS possibly make any money???? I ordered a 3D printer off Bang Good three weeks ago.It arrived in the US two weeks ago.First trip was from Shanghai to New Jersey,then from NJ to Chicago,then back to Pittsburgh,Then down to Memphis (300 miles due north from me) did I get it?Nope,had to go to San Antonio first,then on to Atlanta.

I can't wait until tomorrow when I get another update as to where it is now,meanwhile I know where it isn't

Anyone want to take bets where it will be tomorrow?Since Atlanta is only 600 miles away I'm thinking either Iceland or Poland

[RB211]

Always go with a better shipping option than the free one, from Banggood.

[enginuity]

To answer your question, I don't think USPS actually does make money.

[Mcgyver]

Its a real sore point with regard to unfair trade. iirc, (and this may be an oversimplification) the money stays where the thing was posted. Country to country, you delivery mine, I'll deliver yours. USPS typically wouldn't get anything for the foreign package delivery.

The problem is the Chinese government subsidizes shipping (just like the pegged currency, done to get market share). If you mail something from China and it costs say 10 cents, China post gets it to a US port and then the USPS delivers it for free.

The postage cost doesn't reflect the real cost. (That plus there has to be a huge imbalance in volume between the two directions) Giving it a bit of spin, our governments, by how they are participate in the UPU, are subsidizing Chinese suppliers to compete with local firms. imo, if the China rates are subsidize (everyone seems to think so) the USPS should not honour the UPU deal with regard to China. Imagine if every mail order house in NA was given free shipping courtesy of the gov? It would shut out a lot of Chinese ecommerce

[wierdscience]

I think you've touched upon a real sore point with regard to unfair trade. iirc, (and this may be an oversimplification) the basic thing with postage is the money stays where the thing was posted. Countries take the approach, you delivery mine, I'll deliver yours. USPS typically wouldn't get anything for the foreign package delivery.

The problem comes in that the Chinese government subsidizes shipping (just like the pegged currency, done to get market share). If you mail something from China and it costs say 10 cents (like here the gov sets the postal rate), China post gets it to a US port and then the USPS delivers it for free.

Whats wrong is how low the shipping rates are there to here, the charge being they don't reflect the real cost. (That plus there has to be a huge imbalance in volume between the two direcitons) So, if you want to give it a little bit of spin, our governments, by how they are participate in the UPU, are subsidizing Chinese suppliers to compete with local firms. imo, if the China rates are subsidize (everyone seems to agree) the USPS should not honour the UPU deal with regard to China. Imagine if every mail order house in NA was given free shipping courtesy of the gov? It would shut out a lot of Chinese ecommerce

Well I already assumed by the price that China was subsidizing at minimum the shipping.However so does the US government in the form of monopolies and tax exemptions to USPS.

http://fortune.com/2015/03/27/us-postal-service/

But that is all inside sports,my point was look at the shipping route,is it plotted by a drunk with an Etch A Sketch?

[wierdscience]

Always go with a better shipping option than the free one, from Banggood.

Apparently for the big boxes anyway.

[Mcgyver]

it is funny....I took more literally the Q about them making money. I hope there is something left of the printer when it arrives!

[wierdscience]

it is funny....I took more literally the Q about them making money. I hope there is something left of the printer when it arrives!

Heh,ya that too.I'm wondering if they are using my printer to Mule drugs around the country???

https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2017...5691500265355/

[Mike Amick]

Well I already assumed by the price that China was subsidizing at minimum the shipping.However so does the US government in the form of monopolies and tax exemptions to USPS.

http://fortune.com/2015/03/27/us-postal-service/

But that is all inside sports,my point was look at the shipping route,is it plotted by a drunk with an Etch A Sketch?

Instead of listening to O.J. 's lawyer spin the truth (your info comes from Shipiro) .. listen to the USPS ..

Response from USPS

[Mcgyver]

Instead of listening to O.J. 's lawyer spin the truth (your info comes from Shipiro) .. listen to the USPS ..

Response from USPS

The USPS makes some good points, like the obligation to reach every address. Their mandate is a little different than say FedEx. Their response is interesting in care put into the wording "the Postal Service receives no tax dollars or subsidies for operating expenses" That is not the same as not getting a subsidy. While most think of a subsidy as money, the monopoly granted is a positive externality that is an indirect subsidy.

Anyway, mostly noise imo. the real issue (imo) is China is essentially dumping transportation services and that is costing the USPS and North America firms. Its not really a stretch to say, as a positive externality granted from the gov to the UPU, it is an indirect subsidy from the US to Chinese businesses. If I were in charge of trade saber rattling, I'd threaten with intent to go through with a duty until the China shipping subsidies were stopped. It would help the USPS and north American businesses.

[danlb]

Monopolies are only valuable when it's a true monopoly. I spent almost 30 years working for Utilities that were "monopolies". In the 1980s and 90s the phone company was losing a lot of business to specialized companies that only serviced the high profit areas. The phone company was still required to provide service at fixed prices to every location within their service area, even if it cost a fortune to do so.

The USPS is in a similar situation. Their "monopoly" is severely degraded by the use of email, couriers, Fed-ex, UPS, etc. Even the monthly bills are sent electronically and paid via the web.

The UPU ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Postal_Union ) is the one that established the idea that monies paid for international mail would stay with the originating country.

China does not need to subsidize their postal rates. If Banggood is sending 10,000 packages a day to the US, it can do so cheaply by delivering a shipping container with them to the Chinese post office. The post office then ships the container to the US. If the container ships for $424 it's only 4 cents a package. That $424 was for a 20 foot container from LA to Hong Kong at today's rates, BTW. Once it gets to LA, it's up to the USPS to eat the expenses of sorting all those packages and delivering them throughout the US.

Dan

[wierdscience]

Instead of listening to O.J. 's lawyer spin the truth (your info comes from Shipiro) .. listen to the USPS ..

Response from USPS

Both what the article and the USPS state are partly true.Notice USPS omits the fact that they receive tax exemptions that their competition doesn't. Yes they have some unique circumstances like rural delivery,however that mainly applies to the extremely remote locations like the floor of the Grand Canyon.

And once again none of that has anything to do with the cocked up routing of packages and letters.It's nothing new,this has been going on for years.

[J Tiers]

The USPS makes some good points, like the obligation to reach every address. Their mandate is a little different than say FedEx. Their response is interesting in care put into the wording "the Postal Service receives no tax dollars or subsidies for operating expenses" That is not the same as not getting a subsidy. While most think of a subsidy as money, the monopoly granted is a positive externality that is an indirect subsidy.

Anyway, mostly noise imo. the real issue (imo) is China is essentially dumping transportation services and that is costing the USPS and North America firms. Its not really a stretch to say, as a positive externality granted from the gov to the UPU, it is an indirect subsidy from the US to Chinese businesses. If I were in charge of trade saber rattling, I'd threaten with intent to go through with a duty until the China shipping subsidies were stopped. It would help the USPS and north American businesses.

The USPS is slated for complete destruction. Congress keeps loading and loading more costs on them. They have to put a ton more money toward future pensions than any US corporation has been required to. Small wonder the cost goes up. Congress wants to eliminate the USPS to please their Fedex and UPS huge donors.

But, yes, the US etc have definitely financed the entire rise of china, and has done it willingly. I once looked into imported subassemblies. The duty on bringing in some foreign power supply parts (transformers), so that assembly could be done here by US workers, was several times the duty on bringing in complete power supplies, so that the US workers could all be fired.

We PAID the chinese to destroy our industrial base and put millions out of work. And we CHOSE, with our eyes wide open, to do it.

[A.K. Boomer]

this is the kind of shipping that when it finally does arrive you look at the box and say WTF happened?

meanwhile somewhere in hotlanta there's a bag of assembly bolts laying on the side of the highway just a roastin in the sun...

[wierdscience]

this is the kind of shipping that when it finally does arrive you look at the box and say WTF happened?

meanwhile somewhere in hotlanta there's a bag of assembly bolts laying on the side of the highway just a roastin in the sun...

Shipping damage never ceases to amaze me.I average 15-20 parcels a week at work,most make it safe and sound,but there have been some memorable ones.Old Dominion once delivered a pallet with nothing left but a torn up cardboard box and a string of shrink wrap left,no sign of the two 400 amp disconnects we ordered.
Oh and electric motors,every single solitary electric motor under 70 lbs with a base mount we have ordered,and there have been many,have arrived with the bases bent,all of them for going on 10 years.Despite the plywood bottoms,double wall bottoms and expandable foam packing,UPS can wreck a motor.