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  • #16
    Originally posted by CCWKen View Post

    ADDED:
    Your sine plate won't be stable unless you can affix both ends of the angle. That flag portion will be bobbing up and down like a Whack-A-Mole.
    Hi Ken - the "far end" of the plate will be supported by machinist jacks.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by BCRider View Post
      There is another way to do this. You won't like it though because it means turfing the flat plate you have already.

      The new method would be to run an angled corner relief slot in the round stock. Then drill and counterbore for cap screws up through the round at a 45° from below so the screws enter into the new plate at a 45 through the inside edge of the corner. That way when tightened the screws pull the corner of the plate securely into the corner. No pins needed and a sure fire way to ensure that the plate is dead nutz tight into the corner in both directions.

      If you look at some of the commercial sine plates I think you'll find that this screws on a 45 to pull the round bar into the plate or the plate onto the round bar is a pretty common arrangement. it automatically ensures a tight joint in both directions as long as corner rebates or slots on the plate are machined true in all respects. Have a look at the stuff that shows up when you google for images of "sine plate" and you'll see what I mean.
      I like that idea. Wish it had occurred to me. I could just flip the plate end for end and start over with your idea. Or maybe just "turf" the plate as you say. It was a drop and I think I only paid $8.
      Last edited by jmarkwolf; 03-13-2018, 05:30 PM.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by BCRider View Post
        There is another way to do this. You won't like it though because it means turfing the flat plate you have already.

        The new method would be to run an angled corner relief slot in the round stock. Then drill and counterbore for cap screws up through the round at a 45° from below so the screws enter into the new plate at a 45 through the inside edge of the corner. That way when tightened the screws pull the corner of the plate securely into the corner. No pins needed and a sure fire way to ensure that the plate is dead nutz tight into the corner in both directions.
        I've been giving some thought as to how to approach this method. I've included an AutoCad scale DWG below.

        The bottom image is what I think BCRider is describing. The middle one is how I imagine the setup for drilling the clearance hole for the SHCS, and the top image is how I imagine the setup for counter boring for the head of the SHCS

        Do I have this basically correct? Would four 3/8-16 SHCS's be adequate?

        What would the setup be for drilling into the corner of the plate? Getting a good clamp on the round stock is problematic.

        Forgive the questions, I'm a newbie.


        Last edited by jmarkwolf; 03-15-2018, 02:33 PM.

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        • #19
          Your drawing is exactly what I was thinking.

          I originally suggested cutting a slight corner relief slot in the round piece. But let's alter that idea to kill two birds with one stone. Set up the plate on the 45* angle and mill off a bit of a chamfer. That would give you the required corner clearance and also give you a flat area to use for starting the hole. Although if you did this in the mill another option would be to start with a 3/8" full size flat from a center cutting end mill just where the screws go and just deep enough to show a full circle. Or maybe not quite a full circle. That way you won't have any encouragement for the drill and tap to wander.

          If it were me doing this I'd go for an 1/8" chamfer for the initial corner then cut the 3/8 recesses into position then drill and tap. In my case I don't have a DRO so just to avoid a lot of "by the numbers" stuff I'd do the flat seat, drilling and tapping all in one go for each hole. But if you have a DRO then by all means do all the same operations at the same time using the DRO to set each position.

          Howzatt?
          Chilliwack BC, Canada

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          • #20
            could you weld it and then skim cut the plate?
            www.neufellmachining.com

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            • #21
              Originally posted by dneufell View Post
              could you weld it and then skim cut the plate?
              Welding causes distortion. Sure the flat portion could be skimmed. But the point of any sine plate setup is that the two round bar feet are dead nutz parallel in all respects. And welding could not ensure keeping things that way.
              Chilliwack BC, Canada

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              • #22
                OK, next questions:

                #1. How can I know how to rotate my stock in the vise, so the 90 degree groove is symetrical about my drill axis, and
                #2. how to align the drill so the point of the drill is pointing directly at the v-notch?

                I know to mill a flat spot first so the drill bit doesn't walk.

                Last edited by jmarkwolf; 03-16-2018, 05:00 PM.

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                • #23
                  BCRider.....why not? This dude is just building a fixture using a couple of chunks of steel.....The looks of it..... it just machine stock.....The ends are saw cut and the plate looks like he found in the bin! He is not building a $$$ Hermit Schmidt sine plate.....3 short welds....leave or throw away the screws. Drill and tap you hole spacing followed by a skim cut across the deck. Quick and easy. If your a machinist and need a sine plate , buy a sine plate.
                  www.neufellmachining.com

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by dneufell View Post
                    BCRider.....why not? This dude is just building a fixture using a couple of chunks of steel.....The looks of it..... it just machine stock.....The ends are saw cut and the plate looks like he found in the bin! He is not building a $$$ Hermit Schmidt sine plate.....3 short welds....leave or throw away the screws. Drill and tap you hole spacing followed by a skim cut across the deck. Quick and easy. If your a machinist and need a sine plate , buy a sine plate.
                    Part of the reason for my building this sine plate/mini pallet is to gain experience, not to just bang something together.

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                    • #25
                      You could have also tack welded the plate, drilled your pilot holes through the plate and bar then machine down the tacks.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by 3 Phase Lightbulb View Post
                        You could have also tack welded the plate, drilled your pilot holes through the plate and bar then machine down the tacks.
                        Another good idea! Wish I would've thought of that one too!

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                        • #27
                          building shop tools is always fun......Please show us when your done
                          www.neufellmachining.com

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                          • #28
                            The tack welding idea was a good one!

                            I think you're likely looking at some way to gauge the V. This would be a great time to make up a 90-45-45 triangle of something thick enough to sit in a stable manner. Set the 90 sides down in the "V" and dial in the opposite side for level. For the other direction for doing the counter bore if you had two such pieces with clipped corners you could use them sort of like parallels in the mill vise to hold the "V" centered nicely but pointed downwards.

                            A lot of work to make these things up but I could see the triangle coming in handy for other uses in the future.

                            Or since you only need to flip the parts over to do the counter boring for the screw heads and will be doing that with some relief included perhaps use a piece of cold rolled square bar stock and two "V" blocks. Then clamp down directly to the table with your " Pac-Man bars" resting mouth down on the square stock.

                            In fact having a couple of short accurate square pieces to use in our "V" blocks for times like this would not be a bad project at all. I suggested a longer piece that bridged the V blocks. But it could just as easily be two short pieces that are identical in size which fills in the "V" and extends up to support something like this for just this reason.
                            Last edited by BCRider; 03-20-2018, 03:23 PM.
                            Chilliwack BC, Canada

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                            • #29
                              For aligning the drill to the apex a quickie idea would be to drop in with the end mill that will do the initial drilling seat and just touch it off. If it doesn't touch off on both faces adjust and try again. When it's making a small similar size nick on each side then you're there. You can likely also use the narrow end of an edge finder to find both sides and then split the difference.
                              Chilliwack BC, Canada

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                              • #30
                                I think I've got a couple workable solutions for rotating the work to the correct angle, and aligning the drill with the crotch, however un-scientific.

                                The image on the left shows an "alignment block" sitting in the crotch, but hanging off the end of the round stock, where a 45deg triangle can be brought into contact and used to determine the proper rotation angle, before tightening the vise.

                                The image on the right shows a 45deg bevel cutter indicating the center line of the drill location. Double checking with a peck from a spotting drill, similar to BCRider's suggestion, should be the ticket.

                                Last edited by jmarkwolf; 03-20-2018, 08:49 PM.

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