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How Were These Aluminum Cans Made?

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  • AD5MB
    replied
    anent that video - it is good that instructional videos have gotten past the "early man in his cave" starting point. every furshlugginer video back in school, here's how the caveman solved this problem...

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  • boslab
    replied
    You could bend up the square ones I suppose, one of those letter benders would be a good way, they aren't thick but you probably need a chill or heat sink inside to weld, copper flash and chrome or whichever way it gets done, I wonder in thin stuff if hydro forming might be the answer, well not so much hydro as grease, an ordinary grease gun can knock out 6 or 7000 psi, amazing,
    A mould or die that's square is easy, just an idea
    Mark

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  • 754
    replied
    That would do for the round ones....

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  • boslab
    replied
    There are literally hundreds of steel chemistries and heat treatments for can lines, the DWI line at carnaud metal box was at 1000 cans minuite, mentally fast, dirty steel is the bane of tools, the cans get ironed to microns, sometimes the inclusions are thicker than the steel wall, it splits and messes up the tool, they don't like stopping a line, expensive, the presses work so fast you can't see them without a strobe, amazing steel can get that thin, as said clean steel is vital, big ladles (300 tons plus, aim 340) allow the alumina to float out, sometimes with the help of porus bubbling blocks with argon to lift the crap, sometimes with a rinsing lance.
    Rolling it is tricky too, "coffin rounds" on the mill, start narrow out as fast as poss then gradual narrowing
    The DWI is made at the middle of the sheet width reduction when the profile of the roll is just right wedge correct crown correct.
    You can't as mentioned make cans from open heats, Ie unkilled, mind you can't continuously cast unkilled steel, I tried (by accident) and blew up the caster aka breakout of the slab, must have pored 80 tons into the spray chamber, Big Bang, how we got an untreated ladle is still mysterious.
    We made a trial of ultra low carbon steel cans, that worked, and of calcium killed, too expensive but worked.
    The last steel I had anything to do with chemistry wise was the stuff for easy open ends, that took years to get right, they made millions off licensing that grade, wish I had some of it!
    Digressing as usual you could easily spin the covers you need, not so hard, I've even seen cans fabricated by tig annealed and rolled on a steel plug form with a roller bearing in the toolpost so there's options available to reproduce. The covers
    Mark

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  • Baz
    replied
    With impact extrusion there is no need for lubrication and the pressure is probably hard to measure because it is an impact hitting a piece of metal that doesn't give much then is suddenly molten so pressure drops to zero. Probably a good engineering degree question to work it out.

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  • old mart
    replied
    Shame that the chromed cans were for nothing more than to look pretty, such a waste of technology.

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  • plunger
    replied
    Originally posted by Rich Carlstedt View Post
    Yes its a "Cupping Operation" and also refereed to as a "Draw, Redraw" can

    Rich
    Okay I had the time to google it. Its called a reverse redraw when the second operation turns the pot inside out. It stress relieves it because of the material being pulled in the opposite direction.It always amazed me how the pot operators would stand in front of a massive noisy polisher for nine hours a day, some having done it for twenty years.
    The toilets had a perpetual smell of marijuana wafting around .I think this is how they coped.

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  • darryl
    replied
    This impact extrusion is interesting. Can definitely see the need for a lube. Mostly I'm wondering about the pressure required. I wonder what the peak pressures are?

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  • BudB
    replied
    It seems to me that back in the 70's Coors was using impact extrusion to make their cans where a punch struck a aluminium slug at high speed in the bottom of a shallow die and the material "squirted" up along the punch and the trimmed to length for the capping.

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  • Mr Fixit
    replied
    Hey polaraligned,

    There are some paints and other contact materials that sign manufactures are selling that you might look into. There are You tube's on this topic and this company https://alsacorp.com/about-alsa/ a buddy used. I'm not affiliated with them or have I used it but a buddy did and for an interior car trim piece you could not tell the difference even holding it in your hand. The heat from the tubes might be a problem but you might check it out.

    TX
    Mr fixit for the family
    Chris

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  • Baz
    replied
    Sort of referred to in an earlier post. Before toothpaste and glue tubes were plastic the metal slug was put in the female mould and a male inside mould shaped bar was whacked down so hard the slug melted and flowed up the mould. I remember a school trip where a line of these were banging down at about one a second.

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  • JoeLee
    replied
    The guy in the video mentioned the speed at which the ram forms the can..... I'm surprised at that rate of speed the forming ram doesn't just punch a hole through the disc like a bullet would.

    JL.............

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  • Rich Carlstedt
    replied
    Originally posted by plunger View Post
    .................................................. ........ This is thirty years ago but for some reason I thought the pots were drawn in two stages. But I thought the second draw was in the exact opposite direction. In other words the pot was turned inside out . I was told this helped to relieve the pot of stresses. ...........................................
    Yes its a "Cupping Operation" and also refereed to as a "Draw, Redraw" can

    Rich

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  • plunger
    replied
    I did my apprenticeship with a company that made deep drawn aluminium pots.But I was on the plastics section of the company so didnt pay too much attention. This is thirty years ago but for some reason I thought the pots were drawn in two stages. But I thought the second draw was in the exact opposite direction. In other words the pot was turned inside out . I was told this helped to relieve the pot of stresses. I know they also annealed the pot but at what stage I dont know.

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  • enginuity
    replied
    Originally posted by Rich Carlstedt View Post
    ....the material is critical whether it is aluminum or steel.....
    My materials teacher in engineering night school was one of the people who helped developed the particular alloy that is currently used in aluminum beverage cans. I can't remember how long she said she worked on the problem, but I know she talked at length of the alloying materials of magnesium and manganese to be able to draw the can from one blank and how difficult the problem was.

    This video is pretty interesting on the subject, including deep drawing:

    Last edited by enginuity; 03-23-2018, 11:20 AM.

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