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Time to abandon HSS?

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  • Time to abandon HSS?

    Referencing this video,
    https://youtu.be/H-Sf7Nvkwzg

    He grinds carbide as if it was HSS with diamond wheels, and uses it as if it was HSS. Talks about it at around 48 minute mark, he even go's as far to say he avoids HSS.
    I think a good portion of this hobby treats old advice as gospel, I find myself trying to look forward to the latest and greatest.
    RB211
    Senior Member
    Last edited by RB211; 04-23-2019, 04:13 AM. Reason: Fixed the link

  • #2
    If you always use HSS as if it were an indexable tool, no funky grinds or special shapes, no reason to even have it, I suppose.

    But there are more options when using HSS, unless you spend big bucks, or a fair bit of time making special holders for inserts. And even then, you may not get the full functionality available with HSS, which can be smaller than most inserts and still cut.

    Once in a while it's the only way to do the job without a lot more trouble.
    2730

    Keep eye on ball.
    Hashim Khan

    Everything not impossible is compulsory

    Birds are NOT real, they are spying on you

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    • #3
      Linkey no workey

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      • #4
        Originally posted by true temper View Post
        Linkey no workey
        Same with me. Linky no worky.

        I find that HSS is a lot more universal for me. Learning which carbides are best for each material is part of learning how to use them well. Also carbide of any sort is a lot less tolerant of small idiot moments like stopping the work while the cutter is engaged and causing a pressure chip.

        And even in a carbide=centric shop there is still a need for HSS when custom form cutters are needed.

        I do want to learn more about carbide and use it more. But I won't be giving up my HSS at any point in my lifetime.
        Chilliwack BC, Canada

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        • #5
          Here's the video:

          http://pauleschoen.com/pix/PM08_P76_P54.png
          Paul , P S Technology, Inc. and MrTibbs
          USA Maryland 21030

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          • #6
            I have noticed in Stefans earlier videos he used a lot more HSS back then, nowadays I don't see a single instance of it. I even remember he said he liked HSS in one of his videos, I think. Times change.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by RB211 View Post
              He grinds carbide as if it was HSS with diamond wheels, and uses it as if it was HSS. Talks about it at around 48 minute mark, he even go's as far to say he avoids HSS.
              I think a good portion of this hobby treats old advice as gospel, I find myself trying to look forward to the latest and greatest.
              Same here, dont use much HSS with lathe. Pretty much every form tool is also carbide.

              Carbide WAS more difficult 20 or 10 years ago before the cheap diamond grinding wheels, green silicon carbide wheel makes you just feel miserable..

              Stefan(g) commented this carbide vs hss some time ago also here on forum.
              Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe

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              • #8
                I've got some HSS tools on Aloris holders that have been mainstays for over ten years.

                Sure, they take a tune up from time to time. But they hold together in interrupted cuts when carbide ****s the bed.

                And you will never get those Everede boring bars away from me. ;-)

                The devil you know I suppose...

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                • #9
                  One of the things that scare me the most about grinding carbide is the dust. It requires more in preparation and dust collection is likely a must. Not that I have a suitable grinder anyway, except this homemade thing I made mainly for grinding scraper blades.

                  What would be a good (cheap!) setup for grinding carbide in the home shop anyway, a normal bench grinder fitted with diamond wheels?
                  DennisCA
                  Senior Member
                  Last edited by DennisCA; 04-23-2019, 03:30 AM.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DennisCA View Post
                    One of the things that scare me the most about grinding carbide is the dust. It requires more in preparation and dust collection is likely a must. Not that I have a suitable grinder anyway, except this homemade thing I made mainly for grinding scraper blades.

                    What would be a good (cheap!) setup for grinding carbide in the home shop anyway, a normal bench grinder fitted with diamond wheels?
                    I'm not sure if HSS dust is any better? Better cobalt containing grades like HSS-Co or HSS-E are especially suspicious.
                    Like Seco WKE 45 that contains more cobalt than most carbide tools and also alloyed with lots of tungsten.
                    AFAIK Tungsten carbide itself is the least problematic part in any of these, its the cobalt binder that you don't want to inhale.
                    Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe

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                    • #11
                      Here's a video showing how he grinds carbide, he has a vacuum attached for the dust. I have a HF carbide grinder that they no longer sell, can mount diamond wheels to it.
                      https://youtu.be/v0LPXot-8sM

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by BCRider View Post
                        I find that HSS is a lot more universal for me. Learning which carbides are best for each material is part of learning how to use them well.
                        Yes and no. Ever looked at a tap catalog? So many coatings, geometries, materials, etc. All optimized for a particular need. The exact tap is best, but plenty of others will get the job done.


                        Originally posted by CalM View Post
                        But they hold together in interrupted cuts when carbide ****s the bed.
                        This is a light cut, but the setup is flimsy compared to a decent lathe. Don't know how the spindle bearings feel about it, but the insert held up OK.

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                        • #13
                          Interrupted cuts are not much of problem for carbide. Maybe it was with the carbide grades from 50 years ago but not much today.
                          Carbide still holds together interrupted cuts in hardened steels where HSS poops in seconds.

                          Chatter can be a more of a problem, HSS is more tolerant to that.
                          Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe

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                          • #14
                            In your shop use whichever you wish. I seriously doubt that HSS will become obsolete any time soon. But neither will carbon steels. They all have their uses.
                            Paul A.
                            SE Texas

                            And if you look REAL close at an analog signal,
                            You will find that it has discrete steps.

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                            • #15
                              this tired old one again? You guys need a hobby
                              in Toronto Ontario - where are you?

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