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  • TRX
    replied
    Originally posted by Proudpappy View Post
    In retrospect I've come to understand that choke tubes are out of place on a muzzleloader. But, like a few other things, I just had to have it.
    In "The Gun and Its Development" WW Greener talked about the invention of choked barrels. He has some drawings of chokes from when muzzle-loaders were common, interestingly some of them were bored out, not constricted, below the muzzle. Presumably that made them much easier to load since the choke wasn't a constriction. He even has plates showing the shot patterning on targets.

    Trying to do that with a double, at least after the barrels have been soldered up, would be an enormous hassle, but if you ever get the letch to experiment with a single barrel it wouldn't be too hard to do.

    You can find .PDF copies of scans all over the place; the later 1910 edition is the most common. I went ahead and bought a paperback reprint I keep by the bed; yes, it's over a hundred years old, but it's full of fascinating stuff, even little tidbits like Queen Victoria attending matches at Bisley and starting the proceedings by taking the first shot.

    I was surprised to find that the innards of a common break-open shotgun can be notably more complex than some autoloaders. Once you add cock-on-opening, ejection or extraction, automatic safety, etc. there can be a lot of parts inside that "simple" breech box...

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  • Proudpappy
    replied
    I see your point Ringo. I think I'm gonna leave well enough alone and just let it hang on the wall where its been for probably
    the last ten years.

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  • Ringo
    replied
    Originally posted by Tim Clarke View Post
    I guess I’m missing something here. You say it’s tough to load past the tight chokes. I don’t doubt that a bit. So, you want to eliminate the tubes, and cut off the barrels so no threads or counterbores remain. I agree this will make loading much easier. You won’t have any chokes with straight pipes.

    You also say say you have a cyl and IC choke tubes. Why not put them in and shoot ‘em? It would accomplish the easy loading without any bother cutting off the barrels. As I said before, am I missing something?
    thats my thoughts as well, just put in the cyl IC tubes and shoot it.
    and with a muzzle loader, you can mildly adjust patterning with the load.
    lower velocity load will hold tighter than a high velocity load.
    anyways, with a muzzle loading 10ga, throwing 2oz of shot, geez how much 'choke' do you need?
    No way would I cut the barrels. No way !!

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  • Tim Clarke
    replied
    I guess I’m missing something here. You say it’s tough to load past the tight chokes. I don’t doubt that a bit. So, you want to eliminate the tubes, and cut off the barrels so no threads or counterbores remain. I agree this will make loading much easier. You won’t have any chokes with straight pipes.

    You also say say you have a cyl and IC choke tubes. Why not put them in and shoot ‘em? It would accomplish the easy loading without any bother cutting off the barrels. As I said before, am I missing something?

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  • Proudpappy
    replied
    Hello SteveF, I've had this gun for years and I machined out a tube that is sized to drop into barrel in place of the choke tubes when loading. The interior end of the tube
    is relieved to clear the threads in the barrels while the bore of it matches the the barrel bore. Going from the interior end to the muzzle end the tube tapers outward, like you're
    describing. It works great, it's just that I long ago got my fill of dragging choke tubes and wrenches around with me. Maybe I should have been clearer. It works but I
    don't want to have to do it anymore. Was curious if a competent gunsmith would whack the choke recesses off.

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  • SteveF
    replied
    Even easier. I was looking at a choke tube and noticed it has a very small chamfer on the end. Took a telescoping gage and looks like the taper ends a good 1/4" from the end of the choke tube. So it seems like you could put the choke tube in a lathe and make the chamfer a little bigger with plenty of room to work before opening up the choke. Plus you can buy another choke tube if it doesn't work right. Just a thought.

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  • SteveF
    replied
    Not sure if I'm seeing the problem correctly but if i am - have you considered making something like the tapered cylinders used for putting pistons in the engine block. Those sit on the block, the top is a large enough ID that the connecting rod goes in with the piston and the ID is large enough to easily accept the piston with the uncompressed rings. As the piston is shoved down, the taper compresses the rings to just under the block cylinder ID and the rod and piston drop into the block. Seems like something that slips over the end of the barrel, sized to just under the Full choke ID would solve the problem. Slip it on, load, take it off and no need to irreversibly alter the gun.

    You could also make a "loading" choke tube but that would involve more work for each loading.

    Heck, you could probably make either idea and sell to all the others who have the same type of gun.
    Last edited by SteveF; 09-04-2020, 04:44 PM.

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  • Proudpappy
    replied
    Hello Tim, that was another one of my concerns, dealing with possible burring when cutter exits. Thinking of using a hog mill and taking a thou at most with each pass.

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  • Tim The Grim
    replied
    One of my buds had a nickel plated coach gun. Double barrel exposed hammers.
    He banged it hard one time on the concrete corner of the clay thrower and put a crimp in one barrel.
    We put it in a non submerged Wire EDM and after aligning it, cleanly sliced off less than 1/8” so it remained legal.
    After that he used one of those Caswell brush plating kits to apply some new nickel to the cut and it was pretty hard to tell anything had been done.

    Leave a comment:


  • Proudpappy
    replied
    Hey Ringo, I always used Circle Fly brand wads . Haven't shot it in years. I run by Cabela's in Hamburg Pa everyday so I will talk to their gun gurus and see what
    they think. If they say I'm nuts to try to cut the barrels down then it will stay hanging on the wall.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ringo
    replied
    I shot a bit of trap at Friendship some years ago, had a single barrel full choke. I didnt have the same issues as you describe, yeah the wads were tight to get in, but I kept on shootin'.
    Have you tried any of the newer plastic wads? do you cut your own wads by chance, try a different material?

    Leave a comment:


  • Proudpappy
    replied
    The problem is not that the chokes don't work. They do. Gun has five chokes cylinder, improved cylinder, modified, full, and extra full. When using the more constricted
    chokes, to prevent damaging the wads, especially the over shot wads that are thin cardboard, you have to unscrew the tighter choke then screw the cylinder choke
    in then load then screw cylinder choke out then screw tighter choke back in. Just gets to be an ordeal.

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  • Ringo
    replied
    What with the choke tubes difficult?
    Are they full choke and you trying plastic wads?
    Are they a lesser choke?
    I not understanding the choke tubes making it difficult

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  • Proudpappy
    replied
    Hello Ringo. Nothing wrong with the tubes themselves. Loading is a PITA.

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  • Proudpappy
    replied
    Sure have. In early squirrel season when leaves are still on, which is my favorite time to hunt, anything you're going to pop will right in front of you.
    In retrospect I've come to understand that choke tubes are out of place on a muzzleloader. But, like a few other things, I just had to have it.

    Leave a comment:

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